Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/25/07 08:50:59 AM |
Age 51, IA |
Why don't the evangelical, conservative, protestant churches embrace non-participation in carnal war and non resistance to violence like the Mennonites and others do? These doctrines seem to be clearly taught by Jesus and the Apostles in word and deed. I think that the Kingdom of Heaven is worthy of our ambassadorship to the kingdoms of this world. Perhaps many are uncomfortable with the way that many church groups wrap the Bible in the American flag and are searching for a more heavenly expression of the body of Christ. Thereby becoming easy targets to groups like Emergent with their mystical talk.
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/24/07 06:00:18 AM |
Age 56, AR |
We need to get the showmanship out of the church, meaning the choir director who brings it in, and the Pastor who allows it, and bring back the hymms of the faith. We should not accommadate anyone in message or doctrine who does not appreciate the simplicity of the gospel. If you watch the shows that the "new" kind of church has, it really is appealing, but there is no message to convey, except they can sing, and stir up your emotions to make you think you are praising God. This kind of church makes you really appreciate it when you do have a Godly Pastor who is totally devoted to the truth of scripture.
Brenda
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Re: Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/22/07 07:56:09 PM |
Age 41, NM |
I beg to differ with you about the Bible not saying anything exclusive. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth and the life; no man comes to the Father except by me." That's a pretty exclusive statement and its either a great truth or a great lie. If true, then anyone outside of Christ will not come to the Father. Period. That's why the whole politically correct world will allow you to talk about God, Muhammed, Hara Krishna, Buddha, etc. But if you mention the name Jesus, they load their guns. By the way, I think it also says somewhere that the name of Jesus is the only name, under heaven, given among men, whereby we must be saved. That's a pretty exclusive statement as well.
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/21/07 10:45:49 PM |
Age 54, SC |
Thank-you for your informative article regarding the EC. It was especially helpful since I just read an article from the Christianity Today website concerning the EC (and, needless to say, defending their position). As I read the article, some of what was said certainly sounded convincing, i.e. comments about ministering to post-moderns, with post-moderns etc.I also read another article about Tony Campolo in our local paper since he was scheduled to speak in a (southern) Baptist church here. After reading your article , it helped to clarify some of the fuzzy thinking I was having as I tried to be objective as I read Mr. Campolo's "mission" - self-proclaimed drum major for the EC. He prefers to call himself a "red-letter Christian" than an evangelical, which is pretty much what the EC is claiming to do - living out the Words of Christ. While it sounds admirable, it isn't anything that other Bible believing Christians don't try to do but the heresy that arises is in elevating the "words of Christ" over other Scripture. It's either all inspired by God or none of it is. And while EC's prefer to decline to discuss gay marriage, abortion and other "conservative" issues, no denomination can simply lift out of scripture what they believe to be the "priorities" and ignore the rest of the teachings of the Bible. It is tantamount to false teaching which will result in bad fruit. Thank-you for a well-written perspective on a fairly confusing topic.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/21/07 10:31:25 PM |
Age 54, SC |
Amen and Amen! It gives me hope and encouragement to realize that some of the younger generation (post-modern) does understand the Word of God and has some discernment regarding the apostasies that are happening in these last days.
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Uh...pardon?
| Posted On: 01/20/07 04:45:29 PM |
Age 18, MN |
Are you a Christian (and how would you define it as such)? I know that sounds blunt but I must know where you are coming from. One thing I must point out is that the EC does not really believe in absolute truth, which tends to really weaken (or even destroy) people's belief in alot of what the Bible says (since the Bible states that there is absolute truth). Have a great day!
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Re: I'm questioning your comparisons
| Posted On: 01/20/07 04:31:11 PM |
Age 18, MN |
Well, what's wrong with being evangelical? The Emergents are simply snaking they're way through evangelical churches and are now corrupting them (since many Christian kids don't believe in absolute truth). I actually heard Jason speak live (on the exact tape that was recorded for that matter) on the Emergent Church and he stated that one major reason that he became involved with it was because that it was dedicated to reaching the post-modern culture. However, as time goes on, he left for the reasons he listed. I think that the speakers that he has mentioned are great to learn, and that the ones you mentioned are also great to learn from. This doesn't mean that we have to agree with them 100% (which actually constitutes virtually everyone you meet), but it does mean that they are trying to help you build your worldview on God's Word. Have a great day!!
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Re: Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/19/07 10:51:48 AM |
Age 63, OH |
Wow brother may God bless you with His mercy and grace through our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I suspect you have walked a little traveled road. What a inspired response. I would like to give you something in return:
I asked God for strength that I might achieve;
I was made weak that I might humbly learn to obey.
I asked God for help that I might do greater things;
I was given infirmity that I might do better things.
I asked for riches that I might be happy;
I was given poverty that I might be wise.
I asked for all things that I might enjoy life;
I was given life that I might enjoy all things.
I was given nothing that I had asked for,
But everything that I hoped for.
Despite myself my prayers were answered,
I am among all men most richly blessed.
This was found in the pocket of a dead brother on a civil war battlefield. Lou
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Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/19/07 10:23:52 AM |
Age 63, OH |
As I am reminded of Matthew 23 this thought comes to mind. Jesus said these things about the Pharisees and teachers of the law:implied they were lazy,loved the praise of men,called them hypocrites, called them blind guides,told them they were greedy and self-indulgent,like whitewashed tombs,called them snakes and a brood of vipers, and the ones who kill the prophets. This conversation does not sound very quite or respectful does it. Lou
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/18/07 11:39:04 PM |
Age 68, MA |
The lack of critical thinking revealed in some of the feed back is discouraging. The author plainly stated it was not an in depth analysis, so don't expect it to be such. Do your own research for pete's sake. And God forbid we should name names ! Let's see... Gal 2:11 "But when Peter came to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed." How dare Paul name names.
And that business about Jesus not throwing grenades at the Pharisees. Jesus wasn't into "can't we all just get along". He told the Pharisees that they were whitewashed tombs, and of their father the devil.Those words were definitely verbal grenades.
And the babble about building upon the positive views of these mixed up people. " A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump." Why sort through the garbage when you can get wholesome food elsewhere ? Hanging around compromise will gain you nothing.
Try reading Spurgeon, Taylor, Torrey and Tozer. Most important, read the plain Word of God. It is the "power of God unto salvation."
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Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/18/07 09:20:45 PM |
Age 61, TX |
I would also like to see more lengthy articles on this subject. For the sake of discussion, and in a non-confrontational way, I'd like to ask you to consider the following: Jesus may not have thrown any grenades at the Pharisees and Scribes, but He did confront them. In Mt. 22:29, He told the Sadducees they were wrong because they didn't know the Scriptures. In Mt. 23:3, He tells the disciples and crowds they must obey the Pharisees, "but do not do that they do." In Mt. 23, verses 13, 15, 16, 23, 25, 27, 29 are the seven Woes that Jesus spoke to the Pharisees, calling them hypocrites, blind guides, blind fools, blind men, blind guides (again), blind Pharisees, full of wickedness, etc. Finally in verse 33, Jesus said "You snakes! You brood of vipers." I don't think He focused on any of the positive aspects of their religiousness, only their unscriptural hypocritical ways. I think we need to know how close some groups get to the truth, but only so we can be prepared to discuss the whole truth of the Word in an enlightened way with them when we have the opportunity. Example: Jehovah's Witnesses.
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Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/18/07 07:08:02 PM |
Age 52, NC |
There isn't any EXclusivity in the literal interpretation of the Bible.
The Bible gives numerous entries to tell ALL, ANY, etc. who call on the name of Jesus, repent and they, (too) will be saved.
People EXclude themselves by turning their backs on Jesus, God, the Holy Spirit and the inspired word of God, the Bible, and continuing to live their lives in the practice of sin, because they believe the lies of the their 3 enemies, the world, the flesh and the devil.
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Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/18/07 06:56:29 PM |
Age 52, NC |
I was wondering why the above writer does not say(write) the name of God?
It seems wrong to look at a supposed spelling of God's english name and see a dash in the middle.
Just wondering the rationale.
No offence meant. thank you.
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/17/07 11:56:29 PM |
Age 51, GA |
Seems to me, the real emerging church we ought to be concerned with, usually has spires on top and thinks muhammed was really a prophet of God. Or the more frightening church that has already emerged and taken over our schools, and much of society - secular humanism. Swiping at other Christians is pretty easy work. Where in the book does it say we should dedicate our efforts to apostasy hunting? If their not against us, their for us, right? Maybe you're accomplishing something, I can't tell. I believe this apostasy was going to happen anyway, at least according to my copy of the book. Go forth and spread the gospel, is the true call. Go forth young man, go forth...
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/17/07 08:00:51 PM |
Age 61, TX |
Thank you for your very informative article. Your personal experience with the Emergent Church carries a lot of weight. I was especially surprised by the key errors you listed, and would like to know more. The Emergent Church is a deviation from Scripture. Satan inaccurately quoted Scripture to Jesus, but it sounded so nearly correct that many don't realize it's not. When it comes to the Bible, it's either right or wrong. There's no room for gray. The beginning of tolerance in religion has done so much to destroy soundness in many denominations and certainly in some of the newer versions of religion. Acts 1:16 says "I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes..." Gal. 1:6-10 "I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!....Am I now trying to win the approval of men or of God?...If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ." I looked up the word "different" used in verse 6. If my reference is correct, the original Greek translation would be "heteros," meaning another totally different kind. To be "heterodox" is to be a heretic! I'm the first to admit that Satan is having a heyday with organized religion today, but if any group in heretical in one area, why would anyone trust them in any area? I think it's partially due to the degradation of morals, and the "lite" version of Scripture is a feel-good religion for the sector who puts themselves and their desires at the core of the universe, rather than God. I appreciate your courage to speak out, and hope you're greatly blessed.
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/17/07 05:40:00 PM |
Age 58, VA |
This watering down, turning, and twisting of the the Word was recognized back in the early 70's with "love one another" over not pointing out blatant sins. The mistake we make is focusing on, really, loving ourselves more than God and others. We don't want anyone to think bad of us. It is too late for that, provided we have been crucified with Jesus.
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/17/07 11:55:14 AM |
Age 65, WA |
Dear Jason, Your dad taught me so much. I went to his meetings in Bothell Wash confused on lots of issure's. I bought all of his tapes on religons and the main one's on Catholic's, Mormon's and JW etc. He cleared my mind and I can truly say according to G-d's word, as all he teaches lines up with scripture which is the only truth. It also speaks of apostasy and how we will see it, but Satan's slimy big lie is out there and many are believing it. Churches who have forever warned all of us as kids and now I am 65 and see them embracing the "other Jesus" Paul warned us of. The world is in the chruch, Jesus in the box or wafer and Catholic's have signed them up under their umbrella and the POpe said the Catholic Church worships the same god as Muslims..Hello!! We know prophecy that G-d comanded us to know..so how can they be so deceived..it is because Preachers are not teaching the word and will receive double punishment in that day...along with their prosperty gospel and the church bringing in the Kingdom? No, My G-d said, My kingdom is NOT of this world, but most think they replaced Israel and that they are Israel. they have a rude awakening. as they walk over scripture. Genesis 12:3 tells us those who take Israel lightly or do not bless Her or are silent..are cursed. G-d doesn't change no shadow of turning. He is the same yesterda today and forever !! Matthew tells us that the church would be judged on how they treat her and are against Almighty G-d if they are against Israel or try to take the land , called by His Name. Do they really think G-d is a Covenant breaker? If so, why trust the cross? They need to go read Ezekiel 38 and 39 and the romans and Isa real slow !! Only the Holy Spirit can open their eyes. Man never saved anyone and G-d said it would be like the days of Noah when He took the church..but the one world religion , gov and constution that is coming into play is Satan ran and is against G-d's Word. The tower of babel is what is being built that G-d tore down becasue of violence. Because they refused the truth, G-d said He would send a lit and they would believe it. Apostasy means truth is out. He also said, from such turn away. they are not friends of G-d and a friend of the world is enemy of G-d..think on that Jason. Birds of feather flock together, ever see a eagle fly with crows.?? They think Rev is fulfilled and most think they are little gods..Most are praying and worshiping Mary as the pope said,,,call on Mary to appear..no Jesus..Hello world,,you are in apostasy, trun back..Even the President calls our G-d Allah an says all religions have their own way to heaven...a lie so big the world is excepting it..as it is written..the old New Age,moon god, all occult..from Satan himself.. I have family that is beliving the lie as Satan has words so twisted from truth that they don't see it...And I was even more surprised that Baptist who have always led and knew the word would not except such satanic words...Church Smith Sr. is or has to be devistated that his son is part of the purpose driven church. Warren the next Billy Graham,,HARDLY..remember Satan is a liar, has only a little time left and is going around to steal, kill and to destroy souls..
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Re: Re: Re: Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/17/07 11:06:37 AM |
Age 23, BC |
Im actually amazed at how many people take the "judge not lest you be judged" scripture way out of context. It's like it's become the new 11th commandment or something. It has become a mantra for those confronted in their error and sadly shows that they are not willing to carefully examine scripture, but would rather adhere to popular opinion or lazy pragmatic mentalities. It's very sad that when these people stand before God their justification for such error will burn up, leaving them void of excuse. Lord help your people to discern rightly, according to Your Word.
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I'm questioning your comparisons
| Posted On: 01/17/07 09:23:41 AM |
Age 47, GA |
Thank you for sharing your personal journey thru and out of the EC. I question your list of "theologians" Your list is totally Evangelical. Maybe that is how you ended up in the EC in the first place. Try reading Calvin, Luther, Owen, Hobbs, Dabney, Hodge, Warfield, and Augustine. Now there is some filet for savoring.
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Re: My Journey Into and Out of the Emergent Church
| Posted On: 01/17/07 08:20:57 AM |
Age 60, GA |
It is every local church's sins and perversion of all truths that have allowed these same perversions to be manifested more overtly in these 'emerging churches. These same sins are and have been present through idolitry - spiritually. No one cares to see or listen. You are your own prophets, but are blind and arrogant.
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