Still no true response?
| Posted On: 05/14/09 04:06:56 PM |
Age 21, MO |
First, I very much do await Christ's return. It is that hope of redemption which has driven Christianity for 2000 years. Second, as far as I know, belief in the rapture is not a requirement for being a Christian, and thus I should get raptured if it does indeed occur. Third, if somehow I do get "left behind," then I will thank God for the opportunity to continue to share the Gospel with those who desperately need to hear it. It is no problem for me. Paul himslef said that he longed to know the "fellowship of Christ's suffering." For the Christian, if we claim to follow Christ, then we must recognize that suffering will come before exaltation (Philippians). This is why I see no reason why christians should need to, or want to, escape the Tribulation. When the world is hurting the most and in most need of Christ, we as Christians should be the first to sacrifice our rights and well being to reach out to them.
Finally, I am still awaiting a biblical response to the Context issue I raised for the 2 passages. Instead, the only response is a very presumptious argument that I do not look forward to Christ's return. To add to their problem, I will say look at Lk. 17:22-37. This passage makes it even clearer that those "taken away" are taken to judgment. Let's read the whole Bible in context shall we. I also agree with the point made by someone else here that Christianity existed without belief in the Rapture for 1,700 years. I guess all those centuries of Christians were just poor, unenlightened fools who did not really desire Christ's return...
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Much Ado...
| Posted On: 12/01/08 10:27:44 AM |
Age 57, CA |
I studied eschatology for years and it became an obsession. Please do not do what I did.
Remember, keep your eyes and heart on Christ not on the supposed end time events.
Pray for Pre-trib, don't wait for mid-trib, hope for Pre-Wrath but prepare for post-trib.
We are in troubling times and you Must prepare as though the 7 year period has started already. This is not to say it has but you must prepare by praying, spreading the word and being ready to assist our brothers in Christ unto death.
Eschatology can actually be fun. Take for example the date setters that base everything on Jubilee, lunar cycles and annual years of 360 years. Read up on astrophysics (scientific American, science, etc.) and a theory is being given more credence: A large planetary object passed by in 7 B.C. and changed the rotation of our planet...yup it is in the Bible. Check out how long it took for the H.A.B. theory to become reality...yes the skin of the Earth rotates between 7600 and 10,900 years on its axis. Take into account that we are passing through the Galactic Rift with a huge gravity well at the same time the Sun is ending a 11 year activity period before it rotates. I hope you are reading all this because I do have a point. Not only was Israel established in 1948 but Jerusalem was retaken in 1967.
So, here is the point, it is impossible for us to know the start of the Jubilee system because of the variable planetary rotation in conjunction with a slowing annual rotation along with a short change in rotation along with ancient records being completely lost and only guessed at. How long really is a generation? 40 years? 70 years? Or is it 41.3456 years?
Only God knows. I think that He knew the level of technology our world would reach and yet we can't even be sure about many physical aspects of the planet we live on. You think maybe He accounted for this? He does have a sense of humor you know.
I think I could write a book about all this science fact and fiction and maybe you get enjoyment out of pondering the world events. This will only lead you to inactivity and fear. God is in control and whatever will happen is under his absolute rule.
Your life will be much more fulfilled by spreading the word as you are commanded to do. Tell everyone about Christ not about a rapture, or heaven, or end time events. Be prepared and you can only do the following by having a deep faith, to die for Christ and your brethren.
CK
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Why does the revival tarry?
| Posted On: 10/18/08 06:57:18 AM |
Age 72, SWEDEN |
Hi.
I found your Web Site by Google
And I wish you the best you can get,
the peace of God through Jesus Christ.
Welcome to visit my Site.
Allan Svensson, Sweden
Why does the revival tarry? It is because God's
people tarry to obey the powerful command of
the Lord in Rev. 18:4. This is the most powerful
revival message of the Lord to his people in our time.
www.algonet.se/~allan-sv/INDEX.HTM
As in the days of Lot, it is now. Lot was not interested
to leave Sodom. God sent two angels to rescue him,
and they must persuade him to leave Sodom. When
he yet lingered, one of the angels said to him:
"Flee for your life sake ..."
Just like as Lot, God's people are not interested to
leave the great Babylon, but finally they must flee
for their life from there.
www.algonet.se/~allan-sv/PAGE88.HTM
God's people are destroyed for lack of knowledge
because their preachers have rejected knowledge.
Hosea 4:6-11. Instead to preaching the truth of the
Assembly of God, they have preached lies about the
Assembly of God. The Pentecostalists have abused
the expression "Assembly of God" and used it as a
name of their church.
What does hinder the Antichrist to appear?
What is the Restrainer?
http://www.algonet.se/~allan-sv/MESSAGE.HTM#Antichrist
Why did the Pentecostal Revival take an end?
www.algonet.se/~allan-sv/CRISIS.HTM
The coming revival, a nameless revival
www.algonet.se/~allan-sv/POWERFUL.HTM
What will happen before Jesus comes?
http://www.algonet.se/~allan-sv/BEFORE.HTM
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anti-rapture folks may get their wish
| Posted On: 10/08/08 11:20:24 AM |
Age 52, GA |
There are many respected theologians that do believe in escaping the wrath, and being snatched away before the coming tribulation. It is beyond me, why anyone would argue for something they surely wouldn't want to participate in - the tribulation. Also, there is a crown waiting for those that look forward to His appearing. It seems to me that those who argue vehemently against the rapture, are also among those not looking forward to His appearing. Which may mean they will get their wish and will get to participate in the tribulation... too bad for them. As far as the U.S. is concerned in reference to the end times, there may be another reason for optimism. Maybe there will be an awesome revival, and when the time comes for the rapture, there will not be anyone here but a few naysayers. In His service, by His grace, Porter +++
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WHY PUT BROTHERS DOWN
| Posted On: 10/03/08 11:54:16 AM |
Age 64, OH |
To say false doctrine is false is not being a naysayer. I say that every word that Jesus spoke is true. Read my post above titled "DID NOAH HAVE TO BUILD AN ARK or WAS NOAH RAPTURED". Do you think what Jesus said is not true. I choose to believe Jesus instead of mere men. My blessed hope in not the rapture but the return of the Lord Jesus Himself. Why do you write in a tone that put's those who disagree with you down. Are we not all brother's. Lou
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LINDSEY
| Posted On: 10/03/08 11:44:10 AM |
Age 64, OH |
You are sure correct in saying that Hal Lindsey is NOT a prophet. But he does claim to be an expert in prophecy. Who could be an expert in prophecy except a prophet. Prophecy is the testimony of The Spirit of Jesus and who knows that except Jesus. A prophet is one who Jesus speaks to about these things. When man tries to understand the things of God without bothering to seek God about them, you get the error of these men. Read Hal Lindsey's book "Late Great Planet earth" today, it is a joke, many of these things did not come true. Lindsey did imply that these things would come true by quoting scripture and allowing others to claim him an expert. Those area all signs of a false prophet. Lou
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You have told the truth.
| Posted On: 09/30/08 04:59:43 PM |
Age 50, IN |
I have always said that God will take the eagle (USA) out before the antichrist comes. Why? Because the eagle is never mentioned after the rature of the Bride ( Church) of Christ, Rev.4. Now this eagle (USA) as Mr. Reagan has said will cease to be a nation of power because of the rapture (just as Mr. Reagan has said). So I would say it is expediant that we, Believers,who live in the USA start today (NOW) to tell others about the saving power of Jesus Christ. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
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Not a New Doctrine !
| Posted On: 09/30/08 05:55:30 AM |
Age 41, JAPAN |
The Rapture is not a new doctrine.
Ephraim the syrian realized way back in the third century that the church has to be taken out before the final 7 year tribulation. He came to that conclusion after a careful study of scripture.
God will not mix His two programs for evangilization of the world which are the church and Israel.There is segregation on the earth once again during the tribulation.NOW there is no segregation on the earth, there is only non believing jew, non believing gentile and the christian.
For the israelites to have a legitimate chance to do what they were called to do (spread the knowledge of the one true God), the church CAN'T be here.
We learn this from dispensationalism.
There are MANY other reasons why the church will be taken out in the Rapture but no room here.Why christians work so hard to disprove the blessed hope of the Rapture is beyond me.It was given to be a comfort to the believer.Thank God even anti Rapture christians will be taken out. God ought to leave them here to TRY to endure the Tribulation since they are so against it.Its you sir, who needs to read your Bible....by the Hal Lindsey isn't a prophet and never made a prediction he guaranteed would come to pass.
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What?
| Posted On: 09/28/08 04:17:22 PM |
Age 27, CANADA |
I find it hard to believe that at the outset of the 21st century, men who are apparently biblical scholars would still propagate such a ridiculous patchwork of verses as the rapture. If Christ Himself said "Of that day and hour even I don't know", who are we to predict when these things will happen?
Such speculation only leads to pessimism in evangelism...
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palestine
| Posted On: 09/27/08 09:32:01 PM |
Age 22, MN |
We did not commit a sin when we asked Israel to accept a Palestinian state. Palestine was a peaceful coexistence of Jews, Christians, and Muslims before the Zionists forcefully, and brutally, took over the land after WW2. The history of modern day Israel is drenched in blood. Modern day Palestinians have been socialized into violence and anger by the oppression they suffered from the Israelis over the years. Israel has its fair of sins to account for. -Dan Smith
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Bingo!
| Posted On: 09/27/08 01:39:32 PM |
Age 39, FL |
....and everyone remember the parable about the wheat and tares. Jesus holds the truth, not humans and their silly speculations and wishful thinking.
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Lots of speculation...
| Posted On: 09/27/08 01:33:11 PM |
Age 39, FL |
..in the above post. As well as inductive human reasoning. Also, the eagle became the symbol of Germany way before it became the symbol for America.
By the way, anyone think of why the founders chose an animal for our symbol? That's paganism folks!! The Cross should have been chosen for our symbol. Oh, but that would have offended somebody!! We must not be divisive! Give in to the world, and bow down to unity. Dialogue to consensus, compromise with the non-Christians (like Thomas Jefferson who tried to write his own version of the New Testament, taking out what he didn't like), listen to the serpent and be situational-environmental lovers and people pleasers (humanists, and therefore false 'Christians'). Whoa, there have ALWAYS been FEW that have walked the narrow path.
As for our Constitution, God given inalienable rights mixed with human folly. Truth mixed with lies. Ex: 'We find these truths to be self-evident', humans thinking higher of themselves than they ought!! No, evident because of God's revelation and grace, you wicked minded humans!!
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Poor hermeneutics
| Posted On: 09/27/08 10:20:18 AM |
Age 21, MO |
Hmmm, I lost a lot of respect for this article after the second paragraph which includes two Scripture references that cannot deal with America at all.
Look up Jeremiah 30:11 and 46:28. They say respectively: "I will destroy completely all the nations where I have SCATTERED you," and "I will make an end of the all the nations where I have DRIVEN you." Last time I checked, America was not one of the nations Israel went to during the Babylonian/Persian exile. Even up in Jesus' day, they did not even know North America existed.
Jeremiah 25:15-27 gives us a pretty extensive list of "all the nations to whom I send you" (v. 15), but nowhere do I see America. And no one better try arguing that the "coastlands beyond the sea" is America as this violates historical propriety. In the end, this article, sadly, shows evidence of some very sloppy hermeneutics (methods of interpreting the Bible).
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ONLY the Spirit is truth
| Posted On: 09/27/08 08:26:52 AM |
Age 48, MO |
Yes, Scripture self testifies in the context it is written. The problem is that we Americans bring a lot of baggage to the interpretation. After all, we are Americans, we are special. We are more charitable, we own more bibles, we go to church more, and we have more freedoms. However, all that has done is to proliferate bad theology and wishful thinking because we trust those in a position of leadership to know what they are doing and saying. However, ignorance and stupidity is rampant in the leaders of govt, churches, schools, etc. It is truly amazing how error begets error. It's like the childhood game telephone; by the time the message gets to the end of the chain, the message is nothing like the original and only the first 2 conversants know the true message. Friends, we are responsible for our truth claims and the Spirit will teach us if we seek HIM. But, most are to lazy and will be surprised when that day of reconing is revealed. John
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DID NOAH HAVE TO BUILD AN ARK or WAS NOAH RAPTURED
| Posted On: 09/27/08 08:05:10 AM |
Age 64, OH |
Jesus said it would be as in the times of Noah. By your interpretation, Noah did not have to build am ark and go through the flood. For Noah was raptured and then the flood came. All Holy Scripture is true, not just some of our favorite parts. Jesus makes it very clear that His servants will NOT be taken from the earth before Satan's followers. In Matthew 13 Jesus explains the parable of the weeds in vs 36 - 43 and says the weeds are the sons of the evil one, the good seed are the sons of The Kingdom, the field is the world, and THE HARVEST IS THE END OF THE AGE. In the parable of the weeds; "The servants asked him, 'Do you want us to go and pull them up?' 29" 'No,' he answered, 'because while you are pulling the weeds, you may root up the wheat with them. 30 LET THEM BOTH GROW TOGETHER UNTIL THE HARVEST. At that time I will tell the harvesters: FIRST COLLECT THE WEEDS and tie them in bundles to be burned; THEN GATHER THE WHEAT and bring it into my barn.' " - If we believe Jesus instead of men, we can see that Jesus says we are all here until the end of the age, which of course is the judgment. Jesus also says 1st collect the weeds at the end of the age and then the wheat. It is just the opposite of what you are saying. Lou Newton
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IS THE US THE 4TH KINGDOM
| Posted On: 09/27/08 06:53:40 AM |
Age 64, OH |
George, could not this fourth Kingdom be the US and it could be later than we think. Lou
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THE BUS WOULD LEAVE EMPTY
| Posted On: 09/27/08 06:46:52 AM |
Age 64, OH |
You are correct, John; it will take persecution to make the pew warmers really seek Jesus Christ as their life depended on it. If the rapture came now the bus would leave empty. The real Christians would stay to preach to the lost and the ones who have not given all would not get a ticket. Lou
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re: pathetic
| Posted On: 09/27/08 02:01:40 AM |
Age 52, GA |
I don't know that either of Van Impe or Lindsey actually set any dates, but that is beside the point. There are many other respected theologians that do believe in escaping the wrath, being snatched away before the coming tribulation. It is beyond me, why anyone would argue for something they surely wouldn't want to participate in - the tribulation. Also, there is a crown waiting for those that look forward to His appearing. It seems to me that those that argue vehemently against the rapture, are also among those not looking forward to His appearing. Which may mean they will get their wish and will get to participate in the tribulation... too bad for them.
As far as the U.S. is concerned in reference to the end times, there may be another reason for optimism. Maybe there will be an awesome revival, and when the time comes for the rapture, there will not be anyone here but a few naysayers. In His service, by His grace, Porter +++
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Amen
| Posted On: 09/26/08 11:45:28 PM |
Age 21, MO |
And let's not forget how verses like 1 Thess. 4:17 and Matt. 24:38-41 are completely ripped out of conxtext by advocates of the rapture. 1 Thess 4:17 is all in the context of the Second coming of Christ. Read the whole chapter, not just one verse. This passage is talking about Christ's 2nd coming, which will be heard and seen by the whole world, not some "secret" coming of Christ prior to His 2nd coming.
As to the Matt. 24 passage, again, read the whole passage. Notice who is "taken away" in the days of Noah: the wicked. Therefore, in the context, those who are taken away are taken away to judgment. So, the passage is actually saying it is good to be "left behind."
Finally, read Revelation some time all the way through. You'll find it tough to find the rapture anywhere without making up crazy explanations that are not in the text.
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But what about the mongols?
| Posted On: 09/26/08 09:44:43 PM |
Age 61, MI |
We should not forget that the greatest empire that ever was on this earth was the Mongol Empire, yet it is not referenced in the Bible.
Also, where is the Biblical reference to any of the South American countries? Don't they interact with Israel?
Finally, remember the the absence of evidence (the US being referenced in the Bible) is not evidence of absence (i.e. the US being destroyed).
God bless everyone.
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