SC
| Posted On: 08/11/08 09:21:34 AM |
Age 47, PA |
Your use of Matthew 5 does not change anything I am saying. Forgiveness is required--immediately--in the context of your relationship with God. Reconciliation involves a process of confrontation and response (see also Matthew 18; I Cor. 5).
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STEVE IS CORRECT
| Posted On: 08/09/08 11:48:52 PM |
Age 64, OH |
Dear friend, I think you have missed the point of these scriptures. Steve is correct in his article about forgiveness and reconciliation. In the scripture you mention, if I have offended someone, I can not forgive them, for I need them to forgive me. That is why is says to go and seek to be reconciled with that person. That means I must ask them to forgive me AND ALSO to make the thing that I have wronged them in right. If I have stolen something ie, I must ask them to forgive me AND ALSO pay back four times what I have stolen. That is why Jesus said Zacchaeus had found salvation that day, because Zacchaeus had sadi he would pay back anyone he cheated four times over and give half of everything he had to the poor. Zacchaeus was not only going to ask for forgiveness but also reconcile with the people he had wronged. If someone wrongs me, with the grace of Jesus, He can enable me to forgive them if I am willing. But I can not make them reconcile with me. To be reconciled, them have to see the wrong, then confess it to God and me, and then they need to make it right like Zacchaeus did. Lou
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Not The Same
| Posted On: 08/09/08 02:43:56 PM |
Age 40, NH |
If I am reading your post correctly, you cannot forgive someone without reconciliation. If this is true then you can never forgive the other person unless they repent which is not a biblical teaching.
Matt 18 shows that reconciliation is not required for forgiveness because it is not even mentioned.
Gen 33 shows that Esau forgave Jacob before they met up on Jacob's return. The reconciliation came at the meeting but Esau's forgiveness came before that.
Gen 45 is another example of the forgiveness before reconciliation principle. Joseph had forgiven his brothers before reconciling with them. In fact, he forgave them before they appeared and still before he declared himself their brother.
Luke 23 shows Jesus forgiving and asking the Father to forgive those persecuting Him although they had not repented or asked for forgiveness.
Those are not the only instances where forgiveness is granted before repentance happens (if it happens at all). But what these instances do show is that repentance is not required for you or I to grant forgiveness to someone who has wronged us.
Grace and Peace,
Jim
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Not quite but close
| Posted On: 08/08/08 07:53:58 PM |
Age 35, NJ |
We must offer forgiveness to people...the same way God has an offer of forgiveness extended to mankind at all times. The transaction does not take place in either case, however, until repentance takes place. Interestingly, also, that you distinctly separate reconciliation and forgiveness when they are mentioned side by side in Scripture. You quoted "...whenever you stand praying, forgive, if you have anything against anyone; so that your Father also who is in heaven may forgive you your transgressions" (Mark 11:25), but the other side of the equation is commanded similarly over in Matthew 5:24: "...if you bring your gift to the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there before the altar, and go your way. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift." In the same way that the offender in Matthew cannot make the one he offended forgive him but can only do his part and repent, the one offended in Mark can only extend the offer of forgiveness as Jesus instructed in detail in both Matthew 18:15-17 and Luke 17:3-4. In BOTH of those detailed cases given by Jesus, there are steps before forgiveness is to take place. (Read them afresh! I was shocked too!) It is in love that we go to our offender and seek restoration...and forgiveness. Just as God does with us. The two cannot be separated. And actually, someone mentioned Oprah...she would agree with the author's take on this. The church has slipped into the world's view of forgiveness. And I am not immune! I assumed the same things before I really looked in Scripture. Bless you, brother. :-)
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So True
| Posted On: 08/08/08 12:27:22 AM |
Age 53, KS |
"Forgiveness is setting the prisoner free and finding out the prisoner was me." In my case, I knew I had to forgive, but I didn't have it in me. I asked God for the forgiveness to flow from Him through me to the offender. Offenses kept coming, deep hurt and pain. I had to forgive over and over. I asked God to be my defender, champion, avenger. I committed this person to the Lord and prayed Col. 1:9-14 with the person's name in the verses. After several years, we have reconciled. It is worth it, folks, and God gets all the glory. After all, He is the Master of forgiving.
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A Great Help
| Posted On: 08/07/08 08:44:14 PM |
Age 52, AK |
Thank you for providing such a clear and articulate distinction between forgiveness and reconciliation. So many times forgiveness is expected to be an easy path, with no effort given to restoring the damaged relationship. I hope many people are able to benefit from your wise words.
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Delivered
| Posted On: 08/07/08 07:49:28 PM |
Age 55, PA |
Mr. Cornell, Thank you for this reminder. Forgiveness is not about right or wrong, but a choice to let go of offenses. At times, Satan reminds me that individuals have hurt me. It is one of his many devices to hinder my testimony and my growth. Recently, I discovered I must remind the enemy, as well as myself, that I choose to forgive even if our relationship is never reconciled. Only God can restore trust once it is broken. I continue to pray for new beginnings in these relationships.
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Thank you
| Posted On: 08/07/08 02:39:56 PM |
Age 43, VA |
I just wanted thank you for this article. I found it by "accident". I have a foster child and I was trying to explain this exact thing to her today. I printed it and gave it to her. It really helped. God works in so many ways. I was reading news updates on Prophecy Fellowship message board and ran across this article.
God Bless each of you.
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Thanks Steve
| Posted On: 08/06/08 06:54:17 PM |
Age 40, NH |
Thanks once again for challenging us to act like Christ and forgive no matter what. Forgive as He forgave us...didn't make us earn it...always challenging personally.
Grace and Peace,
Jim
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Thank you
| Posted On: 08/06/08 02:34:18 PM |
Age 61, MO |
I know someone personally who could benefit from this article. I especially like the distinguishing between forgiveness and reconciliation. George Cancilla
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INSIGHTFUL
| Posted On: 08/06/08 10:42:02 AM |
Age 64, OH |
Steve, thanks you for this article. It was insightful and full of true wisdom. It is sad that few will read it. 20,000 read the article about Oprah and few will read this. The sad thing here Steve is that are not rejecting you but they are not really interested so much in really hearing from the Lord Jesus. Jesus truly is a Man of sorrows. Thank you again for the article. Lou
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