Rick Warren, please preach Christ.
| Posted On: 06/04/08 08:47:40 PM |
Age 34, PA |
It is great to see a dialog, the preaching one thing and having a doctrinal statement that is good is exactly the problem I see as well. If a pastor or evangilist believes in the Bible he will preach the whole thing in truth. Even the hard passages. If the man is not preaching what he has written down for a statement of belief then he is suspect.
God bless
Greg
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Remembering the Word in the Debate
| Posted On: 06/04/08 07:25:22 PM |
Age 100, TX |
Since DeWaay's message brought to Rick Warren was to preach Christ, maybe we should consider His words here: "Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven." It is distrubing to see the judgmental spirit on this website of other's work and ministry. And, if 'Sola Scriptura' is the argument lets also consider Jame's words: "Brothers, do not slander one another. Anyone who speaks against his brother or judges him speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it, but sitting in judgment on it. There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge...?" Nowhere in Scripture are we told be critical of another's work for the Lord. The false Gospel being referred to in Galatians, 2 Peter and Jude denied the power of Christ and His resurrection; there is no evidence that this is the case with Warren's ministry. While Rick might employee some non-conventional thinking in his approach to a post-Christian culture, Paul did tell us that he became all things to all people to win some to Christ. Only the Lord stands as judge of our works and if Rick is that way off he too will be judged by the only One able to rightly do so.
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false teacher
| Posted On: 06/04/08 05:43:21 PM |
Age 55, IL |
Why not just state the obvious -- RW is a false teacher in the full Biblical sense. 2 Peter 2:1-3 -- if this doesn't apply to RW, then who? (Doesn't matter if he mouths come orthodox doctrine -- judge by fruits: Matthew 7:15-20.)
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The Gospel is preached at Saddleback
| Posted On: 06/04/08 05:34:19 PM |
Age 53, OH |
I did go to Rick's church years ago. I go now when I am in town. The last time I visited in April, I heard a clear-cut, gospel message. In fact it was as straight forward as any gospel presentation I have heard from Mark Cahill or Billy Graham.
I observed the Bible Studies offered to its members at a table outside the building. Beth Moore, Kay Arthur, The Truth Project were just a few. I saw people praying for one another on the patio and people getting baptized as they proclaimed their faith in Christ as their Savior, redeeming them from their sin.
My son hosts a small group in his home. They have a group of married couples, all fairly new Christians, eager to study the scriptures. They meet for prayer, share their struggles, look in the scriptures for how God would direct them. They came to Christ at Saddleback.
My daughter-in-law just got back from Rwanda. Her team worked with local church leaders, encouraging the saints, praying, reading the
It would seem that there are many other issues in our world that would require our vigilance than a church that leads people to Christ, grows them in their faith and sends them out to the nations.
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you are so right
| Posted On: 06/04/08 05:03:14 PM |
Age 47, IL |
You are so right. I too have noticed the creeping surrender in many good churches. There is a subtle war underway to alienate bible believing conservative christians. This is being done on multiple fronts. Politically we are alienated. We don't have anyone who is vying for our support in the presidentail race. The churches are calling us divisive and "in your face". I do EE and am currently teaching Way of the Master. When I talk to pastors and lay people about the need to make sure people understand they are lost before they would even want to be saved they dismiss me. All of the bulletins in our church use words such as "casual dress, a place to have fun, come and make some friends, etc..." While all of those things are good they do not attract people who are lost.
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Rick paid for the trip
| Posted On: 06/04/08 04:50:33 PM |
Age 37, MN |
don't get all excited about Bob and Chris having the guts to go to Rick's face...
THAT is not a Biblical requirement for confronting false teaching. in fact the opposite is true. We are to publicly mark false teaching and correct it, so that all will understand what they heard that was wrong and hopefully be able to repent of it and weed it out of their thought process.
21, NC, Bob and Chris and everyone were invited on Rick's dime, so they didn't waste any gas money.
Those who declined the invitation also have my respect, BOTH that group and Bob and Chris did what they did for good and biblical reasons.
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bob quotes his book
| Posted On: 06/04/08 04:45:47 PM |
Age 37, MN |
age 57, VA, Bob quotes his book in order to say he has said this before, that's all. What he said in his book is Scripture. If we aren't supposed to write and talk about Scripture why are you here?
How is PD different than this website? This website tries to remain Biblical and apply consistent hermeneutics rather than... whatever kind of wordgames Warren is playing.
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Statement of faith - Window Dressing
| Posted On: 06/04/08 03:46:11 PM |
Age 65, AZ |
If you read Benny Hinn and Todd Bentley and other apostate and false teachers' "Doctrinal Statements" you will find nothing wrong. However. the statement is merely window dressing, a cloak for the false teaching to disarm the unwary. Actually, it is a prostitution of the Holy Word of God. That is a charge that should make anyone shake in their unholy boots. It is a misrepresentation of sound doctrine and makes a mockery of it.
It is never wise to try to reason with a deluded pawn of the enemy. They are laying a trap and they and their apologists are very clever. As was proven, they took advantage of Pastor Dewaay's good intentions and twisted and misconstrued his commnets to mislead people into thinking that Dewaay had capitulated to Warren. Let that be a lesson to anyone in the future.
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Sad
| Posted On: 06/04/08 03:20:35 PM |
Age 52, CA |
"My book is better than your book." That seems to be the point of the author. I applaud Rick's graciousness to reach out to understand his critics. I'm saddened that his critics display little grace. I'm not a follower of Rick's methodology -- really, I'm not a RWD -- but I do think aligning him with "Lucifer" as one of the World-view clones did in a post (and they do this kind of thing often) does not cause Our Lord to smile. Also, it appeared to me that the writer (critic) considers himself to be infallible in all he teaches. He seems to say, "Follow me. I've got everything right." Somehow, I think that says everything anyone needs to know about the writer and cult-followers of World-view Network. As the writer admits, he's a man-follower. He just chooses to follow MacArthur instead of Warren. I don't find that sufficient. Generally, I tend to agree with much on World-view Network, but many times, as in this case, the writer's sadden me. Some World-view (many in fact) sound like those taking up the Crusades--not a high-point in Christian history. Should this post not see print because I refuse to pile on Rick, I still feel better knowing I wrote it.
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BIGGER FISH TO FRY THAN RICK WARREN
| Posted On: 06/04/08 02:46:00 PM |
Age 58, TN |
I have never read the purpose driven book. And I really don't care what it says or what it promotes. What does bother me is people who attack other people. We've been leaders in "the church" for years and what I have come to realize is the religious spirit is alive and working over time. The Pharisees did the same thing to Jesus...He called them white washed tombs. Don't we all have enough on our own plates to concern ourselves with these others? Since when, did God call man to expose the sin of others? Isn't that the work of the Holy Spirit? In the last days we can expect many wolves in sheep's clothing to be raised up. I'm sure some may think you are a wolf...that's why we are not to judge others.
We're all guilty of finger pointing and faultfinding...there is no doubt in my mind...if I took a magnifying glass to your life I'm sure we would find some things that would shock the Body of Christ. Rick Warren and his movement is the least of our problems.
Come on people ...stay focused our Nation is being taken over by Islam..now that's something to be concerned about. Practice what you preach...repent and move on.
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'Statement of Faith' is what we actually preach
| Posted On: 06/04/08 01:26:05 PM |
Age 70, OR |
Blessings Pastor DeWaay,
It is one thing to "believe orthodox theology" as Rick Warren says does, but quite another to actually proclaim orthodox theology.
Many today point to their orthodox, fundamental 'statement of faith' while proclaiming faddish doctrines. It is a way of hiding.
But a statement of faith is not what we say we believe; it is what we actually preach.
Perhaps of the best pieces of advice I ever came across was: We should never preach anything which wouldn't take a Savior to die for!
This is of course why our message is to be "Christ-crucified."
This is the prism which the popular cliches 'seeker-friendly,' 'purpose-driven,' 'motivational speaking,' 'prosperity, health and wealth,' etc., needs to be put through.
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Absolutely!
| Posted On: 06/04/08 11:38:45 AM |
Age 51, GA |
Jesus NEVER compromised with the enemy by saying: "Hey lucifer, maybe we can work together on this one". And Rick Warren is considered to be one of their "deep thinkers"...it's deep alright.
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I Told Ya'
| Posted On: 06/04/08 11:31:54 AM |
Age 51, GA |
Here come the defenders. How do you recognize them? They always start with: "I'm no follower of Rick Warren but..." or "I'm no fan of Rick Warren but..."
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How's This Site Different?
| Posted On: 06/04/08 11:24:37 AM |
Age 51, GA |
By being salt and light. It's a requirement.
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Pushing the same thing?
| Posted On: 06/04/08 10:36:20 AM |
Age 57, VA |
Well I enjoyed reading this article.I am not a follower of Rick Warren.However,if you are going to criticize or be critical of someones work in ministry or their written publications,it would seem a bit over the line by using your own expression "in my book...".
If you will stay away from your own authorship and stick to the facts as our Lord has revealed to you,it would make a more credible argument
for the preaching of the Gospel.
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I wish I could have been there!
| Posted On: 06/04/08 10:08:26 AM |
Age 33, TX |
First my age is not correct, on purpose. After being through two Purpose-Driven "Transitions" and experiencing the worst sort of ageism, I am extremely sensitive about this issue. I think the age requirement on this site should be removed. I am over 50 which disqualified me from knowing anything in PD circles.
However, if I do get posted, I want to say thank you so much for speaking in our behalf. I am convinced beyond any doubt that Modern Evangelicalism is in the throes of the most subtle deception in its short history. And there is probably no turning back. Warren is the leader du jour of a deformation of the Christian Church. The ideas and assumptions driving this movement have not been carefully examined, and are mindlessly parroted by thousands of undiscerning church members.
Frankly, if I were not a Christian, based on what I am seeing happen in the churches, I would not become one. I see nothing I need in the churches. I can easily get exotic coffee, loud simplistic music, and self help advise elsewhere, along with a host of other commercial and material amenities. What happened to things that only God can do? Like holiness? Silliness, superficially, and materialism abound. The Temple needs a cleansing. Keep up the good work. And have you heard Paul Washer preach? Not everyone has bowed the knee to Baal. WS
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Re: My Visit to Ask Rick Warren to Preach Christ
| Posted On: 06/04/08 09:40:19 AM |
Age 21, NC |
I'd have saved my gas money and turned them down. I'm pretty sure Rick's mind is made up, his heart is hardened, and outside of divine intervention I don't think that's going to change.
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How is this website different...except on success
| Posted On: 06/04/08 09:29:53 AM |
Age 31, MO |
I am not a Purpose Driven fan. I believe that it is irrelevant to the future church. But, how is it any different than the face of this website? A man takes a central message and tries to apply to a specific context. Unfortunately, it seems you all are talking to each other and forgetting the rest of the world.
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Well Done!
| Posted On: 06/04/08 08:53:06 AM |
Age 49, MT |
Rather than standing afar and lobbing grenades, you went and actually talked to him. I appreciate that so much! It's hard to believe that some people opposed you doing this. Thank for making a holy attempt to restore this man to the preaching of the Gospel. Now may the Spirit of God quicken the Word in Warren's heart.
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Pluralism, Dominionism, ect...
| Posted On: 06/04/08 08:50:58 AM |
Age 53, MN |
The question that DeWaay must answer publicly now is this. Is Rick Warren a false teacher and is The Purpose Driven Life and P.E.A.C.E. a false gospel as referred to in Galatians, 2nd Peter, and Jude? This is a yes or no question for a man with DeWaay's abilities and the cause and effect information regarding these teachings he has personal knowledge of. It would be going even further towards legitimizing Warren not to answer yes or no.
The correct answer will have clear implications for all authentic church leaders who interact directly with Warren in the sense of sin, guilt, and shame. These are issues that require repentance and it is a great sorrow to say this. But this situation must move in the correct direction. On the basis of Galatians, 2nd Peter, and Jude the church must not move towards Warren.
The very worst brand of Pluralism and the very worst three legged type of Dominionism are not Christian doctrines they are antichrist doctrines. These doctrines are not theologically acceptable. Warren should not be given the right hand of fellowship by church leadership.
S.S.
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