I am Sorry
| Posted On: 04/24/08 01:03:28 PM |
Age 51, TX |
I am sorry for: allowing unbiblical preaching to come from the pulpits for the last 100 years or so; not preaching the whole counsel of God (Acts 20:26-27); doing the world a disservice by not using God's law to show sinners the reasonableness and justice of hell; the people on TV who,in the name of Christ, preach sugar-coated, watered down, man-centered messages and are afraid to talk about sin and are constantly asking for money;not engaging the culture and warning them about judgment. By the grace of God and because of people He has provided to teach me (Ray Comfort, Mark Cahill, Paul Washer, Brannon House, Todd Friel, Darrel Rundus, and many others), I am able to make up for the past. But I am grieved over the condition of "the church."
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Calling people to repentance
| Posted On: 04/24/08 11:05:56 AM |
Age 36, CA |
Has anyone even listened to the sermon given by Pastor Richard Mark Lee? I have. You can listen to it online for yourselves. All of those who have cast judgment on a brother in Christ, especially an elder in a church, without even knowing what he actually said, are sinning.
This pastor has said many of things that are true of the Christian church in America. Christians tend to sit around and condemn the world and the behavior of those who are not saved instead of mourning over the fact that the lost are doing what is natural: sinning. This pastor has only stated that the way to change society it to preach the gospel of Jesus Christ to the lost instead of protesting wickedness. He is calling Christians to repent of their arrogance and pride and to humble themselves. He is calling people to be more like Christ by reaching out to the lost instead of condemning them.
Are we not in a spiritual battle? Are we not called to make disciples of the nations?
Are we called to cast condemning eyes on those who don’t know Christ? Are we called to scoff at sinners? No, we are not. That is pride my brothers and sisters.
Yes, this pastor has a typical seeker friendly service. I completely disagree with the way he conducts his worship service, but the message he gives is not what you think. Take the time to investigate for yourselves.
Dave
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Yes, and this also
| Posted On: 04/24/08 08:37:04 AM |
Age 47, MO |
Not only what you said but also consider this. We Christians like to mark ourselves as seperated from the world by our externals; we no longer smoke, we don't drink, we don't cuss, we size others up by our standards, we keep laws of civility and cleanliness, etc. These may be fruit we demonstrate, however, we forgot the mark of a Christian is not the externals but rather the internals. The changed Christian heart follows the Holy Spirit, demonstrates the love of Christ, reaches out with a non judgemental "God is working here" attitude that has faith that God is I AM, and we are saved by grace. John
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pround grandparent
| Posted On: 04/24/08 07:53:07 AM |
Age 42, TN |
You should be proud of your grandson to have the boldness to take a stand and actually tear down the signs. Sure he may be in trouble. I am sorry and upset to hear that, however, it is good reason to be in trouble. He took a stand for righteousness.
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perception
| Posted On: 04/24/08 07:49:47 AM |
Age 42, TN |
I think that alot of times the church is willing to accept people as they are, however, before a person comes to Christ he feels conviction in heart for his sins. That is often percieved as judgement from the church when in reality it is their own feelings of guilt and shame.
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where is his heart?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:59:30 PM |
Age 47, NC |
i didn't hear the sermon but i did read the article via the link. many lost DO believe those in the church are extremely judgemental because we ARE. we DON'T show them God's love for them even tho they are sinners because we don't believe that God loves US and we are STILL sinners. when WE don't truly KNOW God's love we cannot GIVE God's love. we too often expect people to clean up BEFORE they can come to God and forget that God is the ONLY ONE who can clean us up. Come as you are - but don't stay as you are is what we SHOULD be preaching. how many of us were saved and immediately became perfect and never sinned? EXACTLY ZERO and anyone who says otherwise is deceiving themselves and lying on top of that - a sin. so yes we SHOULD apologize to those whom we've judged because of their sin. We need God's eyes so we can see them as He sees them not as we see them. All sin is death - there is no sin that is worse than another because when we sin, and yes even the saved sin just ask the apostle paul, we basically throw Jesus's sacrifice back at Him. He found us worthy when we were yet sinners but we can't do the same for others that He also found worthy? shame on us. of course we also need to ask God for forgiveness.
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Will God apologize?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:37:01 PM |
Age 37, MN |
I think Billy Graham summed it up and put it very poignantly when during one of his sermons he stated, "If God does not judge America, He will need to apologize to Sodom & Gomorrah."
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Has God apologized?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:35:03 PM |
Age 37, MN |
I think Billy Graham sums it up and put it very poignantly when during one of his sermons he stated, "If God doesn't judge America, He will need to apologize to Sodom & Gomorrah."
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Wolves in sheeps clothing
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:19:16 PM |
Age 47, FL |
Ted Haggard...
If a Pastor like that can fool everyone, why not some back water fellow like Mr. "I'm sorry" in Ga.?
Remember, your salvation is dependent on your personal relationship with Jesus and not with your Pastors.
But, understandably, wouldn't be nice to be in a church that runs above reproach!
Pray Hard!
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BEFORE THE FLOOD
| Posted On: 04/23/08 08:50:15 PM |
Age 64, OH |
I find your remark about homosexual marriage before the flood interesting. Can you tell us the name of this person or any other details of what he said. Thanks. Lou
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We're Sorry
| Posted On: 04/23/08 08:36:31 PM |
Age 76, NY |
If there's anything we should really be sorry about is the apathy and complacenccy that Christians have concerning maintaining our rights. Schools founded on Christian principles are now secular, all insinuation of anything Christian is disallowed, removal of the 10 commandments, and the exclusive teaching of evolution in our public schools is a tragedy. We have much to be sorry for and it centers around our ineffectiveness with defending our faith. Today, at my Grandson's school was "Gay Day" with posters all over school grounds eliciting tolerance for gays. He is in trouble for tearing the signs down. There is no effort to have "Christian Day" to show tolerance for Christians. What hypocrisy to have a day celebrating a sinful perverted lifestyle but intolerance for one that is Christly. Christians keep fiddlin, while Rome burns! We have cause to be sorry!! Maybe "sorry" should be changed to "shameful'
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One Sorry Church
| Posted On: 04/23/08 07:37:05 PM |
Age 47, WA |
This is exactly what the problem in the American Church is! Pastors do not have the back bone to stand up against sin! Jelly fish, milk toast effeminate hirelings that care not the homosexuals are taking over the whole country and have taken the government! Any true Church of Jesus Christ should never apologize for sin! Jesus never compromised with sin and His true church never will either. The man of God needs to stand in the pupit and attack sin and exalt righteousness period. Warning people of the judgment to come is not "being judgmental" if the pulpits would get fire and preach truth, Gods Law we would see back bone but not until.
Galatians 3:24
So that the law is become our tutor to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
But now faith that is come, we are no longer under a tutor.
Preach Christ crucified for the sin (homo, abortion) of the world!
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agree
| Posted On: 04/23/08 04:08:30 PM |
Age 47, TX |
I agree. Why should the church apologize for calling sin what it is? We did not define sin - God did that for us. We do not embrace drunkenness, so why should we embrace homosexuality? If you don't feel convicted when you leave a church service, you are probably going to the wrong church.
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Preach Repentance
| Posted On: 04/23/08 04:03:17 PM |
Age 52, OH |
To the writer who says we should be preaching God's love - let's not forget that we are to preach REPENT, FOR THE END IS NEAR. Unless and until a person gets a clear understanding of his position before a Holy God, preaching the love will run the risk of giving him/her false hope. Without repentance, there is no salvation. God does love us - but He has set forth His requirements for individuals to be saved and a true repentance is the first prerequisite. Do we need to be more 'tender' in our approach? Frankly I think we have become TOO tender! We're so afraid we might offend or appear judgemental that we refuse to sound a warning to the unsaved around us. That's not love! Witnessing for Christ is not designed to win you more friends, it is designed to win souls for eternity. We need to be clear that the soul that remains uncleansed from its stain of lies, cheating, theft, adulterous thoughts or actions, homosexuality, murder (including abortion), and all the other sins of a human heart WILL BE DAMNED. Once we sound the warning, only then is it appropriate to share the love. Jonah didn't walk into Ninevah preaching God's love - he preached repentance! And the entire city took heed! Paul didn't mince words, and neither did Peter. Was every individual who heard them saved from the experience? No - but we aren't to worry about the harvest. Our directive is to share the gospel - the WHOLE gospel, not just the love. We need to get our godly backbone in shape and warn those in danger.
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Would Christ have run that headline?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 01:21:19 PM |
Age 60, NEW ZEALAND |
We need to know all the facts here before rushing to judge. Christians can sometimes be too confrontational and quick to take a lofty "I am right and you are wrong" approach. Remember Christ at the well. He didnt rush to criticize. He reached out in love. He didnt compromise Himself but His demeanour was that of a servant, gentle loving and firm.
Sinners of all types are potentially our brothers and sisters and children of God if they respond to the work of Christ. We have no right as those also only here by the grace of God to be loud in judgement.
Lets stop sitting on our high horses of righteousness and 'holier than thou', quoting all the scriptures that condemn and justify our stance and find the ones that speak of love and forgiveness so we are truly the Bride of Christ - people of grace and beauty.
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I missed the heresy
| Posted On: 04/23/08 01:05:25 PM |
Age 58, NC |
I am a conservative pentecostal minister and have great difficulty understanding what is heretical about saying these issues are sinful but come to church and find hope and the truth through repentance. The church has missed opportunity after opportunity to witness to the lost because we are so holy we can't talk to a sinner. I was a sinner, but thank God someone came into my sex and drug filled life and had the love and patience to bring me to the truth of salvation. I guess we should strive to be like Jesus who spent his time with the Pharisees picketing the Roman Baths and condemning those who broke the Law. Wake up,Church, while it is still light and open the walls of your holy sanctuary so the fresh breath of the Holy Soirit can waken you out of your unholy legalism and blow the gospel into the community you judge. Let he who is without sin hold the first picket sign.
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Discern vs judge
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:57:39 PM |
Age 59, VA |
You say, "The combative stance has shown itself not to work!" So I guess, the fact that Jesus said he came not to bring peace but to bring a sword between sisters and brothers and to set a man at variance against his father and daughter and mother etc..." doesn't fly anymore either! That is what is wrong with the Church today! The Word is forever settled in heaven and we are to dust our feet off and move on, not apologize for the Word, to the person who will open their heart to hear what the Spirit is saying. -Not what they want to hear. The church is filled with a lot of wimps- mostly unsaved- I do believe. What ever happened to taking pleasure in persecutions and afflictions and in distresses for Christ's sake? It is a crying shame that those who call themselves Christians cannot discern the difference between judging a person and hating his sin. We are to discern right from wrong. And that we can do without judging! Homosexuality and abortion are abominations to the Lord. If we cannot declare these truths, we have lost our salt. We are good for nothing. Those that call themselves Christians need to toughen up and pray for a door of utterance that they may be able to speak the Word with boldness, as Paul did. Hell is a reality and no drunkard nor effeminate, no murderer will enter the gates of Heaven without Christ. Let us not apologize but rather evangelize!
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...but by the law
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:55:29 PM |
Age 24, IA |
I agree that we only come to Christ by understanding ourselves as sinners in need of a savior... but scripture tells us in Romans 7:7: "What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. May, I had not known sin but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet." Jesus demonstrated this over and over... he didn't walk up to the woman at the well and say, "Hey, I love you, let's be best friends!" No, he asked her where her husband was-- knowing full well she was an adulterer, breaking the law of God. God gave us His law to show us we need Him! Just a thought. :)
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It's all about love...
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:35:19 PM |
Age 33, PA |
I think that what this pastor did in offering a humble public apology was completely in line with Scripture. He did not apologize on 'behalf of God', but on behalf of a judgmental mindset that many 'Christian believers' have in respect to how they view unbelievers, and others in the process of deliverance. As the Word of God states in the New Covenant in Christ Jesus, we are known to be the children of God by our love for one another; God is the only judge. While we are to use discernment in respect to our dealings with others (being equally or unequally yoked), we are supposed to love without judgment with 'no respect of persons'; unlike the hypocritcal Pharisees and Sadducees of Jesus' day. While this website is informative, at times, I find it upsetting that one would deem themselves to be in the position of judgment and continually berate, belittle, and condemn their Brothers and Sisters in Christ based on their opinion. One must be wary as an Old Testament prophet stated to "touch not (God's) anointed and do His prophets no harm." Preach the Gospel in love and so fulfill the will of God in Christ Jesus for all mankind.
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Oh, nuts!
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:33:54 PM |
Age 55, TX |
I just saw the fine print. They are Baptist or sort of anyway. Men died defending the truth under the name Baptist and at one time ana-Baptist and I am not ashamed of putting in the bold print versus the fine.
Well, again if you aren't convicted of your doctrine and honored to be among the ranks of martyrs and defenders of liberty then take it off completely not use it in the abbreviation or fine print.
Here is one preacher that is Baptist by conviction and honor and pray to be so until death.
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