GOD- HEAVEN-EARTH
| Posted On: 01/22/08 06:10:07 PM |
Age 64, OH |
I did not explain this because I thought it was obvious. GOD - HEAVEN - EARTH are the nouns in the sentence. And CREATED is the verb. the nouns and the verbs are the main words in the sentence. So you see it was not silly at all. By the way you said this could be done with other Greek works; when can we expect to see your post showing us this is true. If you can not produce this then you should tell us that it can not be done. Awaiting your post. Lou
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silly
| Posted On: 01/22/08 01:02:32 PM |
Age 37, NY |
Why did Ivan choose GOD-HEAVEN-EARTH? Why not IN-GOD-THE? Why the verb? Why the first middle and third words? Why not the second, forth and sixth? His method is arbitrary and silly. Only a fool would subcribe to such nonsense as this. Even if I were a believer would I fall for this one.
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DO THE SAME WITH HOMERS WORK
| Posted On: 01/14/08 12:41:41 PM |
Age 64, OH |
Here is the work of Ivan on the first verse of the Bible.
Ivan was aware that the Hebrew and the Greek language was the only two major languages that the characters stood for letters AND FOR NUMBERS. So he took the first verse of the Bible as numbers instead of letters and worked with them to see if these math patterns that was in all of life was in them. IN THE BEGINNING GOD CREATED THE HEAVENS AND THE EARTH. Ivan added up all the numbers in the three words of GOD - HEAVEN- EARTH. Ivan was struck by the fact that they added to 777 or 111x 7. Ivan took the verb Created and found that it was 203 or 29x7. Ivan took the 1st, last, and middle word and found that they added to 133 or 19x7. Ivan took all seven words of the verse( in the Hebrew there are 7 words in the verse not nine) and found that the 1st and last letters of all seven words added to 1393 or 199x 7. the total number of letters in these 7 words are 28 or 7x4. Now Ivan became struck by the fact that there were exactly seven words and not 6 or 8. Ivan found many other ways to add the letters and they were all divisable exactly by 7. Ivan was now shaking and went on to discover EVERY VERSE OF THE HEBREW AND THE GREEK IS JUST LIKE THAT AS FAR OF BEING FULL OF RANDOM MATHEMATICAL PATTERNS.
Ivan concluded that the Bible was NOT WRITTEN BY MAN AT ALL. BUT IT WAS WRITTEN BY THE SAME ONE WHO CREATED ALL OF NATURE. Panin could see that the same mathematician had created all of nature and written the Bible.
Now I challenge you to take the first sentence of any other Greek work of old and show the same as you claim. Lou
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Texas sharpshooter fallacy
| Posted On: 01/13/08 04:52:58 PM |
Age 37, NY |
The reason Panin didn't find patterns in Hebrew or Greek texts is because those findings were not his objective. Those with an interest in finding mathematical patterns in the Torah have found them. It's all a matter of how you set up the experiment. One could write a formula that shows a mathematical pattern in the Harry Potter books. This formula would undoubtedly not reveal patterns in the bible. But it doesn't prove or disprove either. Panin is guilty of the Texas sharpshooter fallacy.
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THIS IS NOT JUST ALGEGBRA
| Posted On: 01/11/08 01:09:37 AM |
Age 64, OH |
Are you talking about what you know or what you think. You are just plain wrong about Panin. Panin checked all the great texts in Hebrew and Greek and found not one work except the Bible that had these patterns. Remember Panin was an atheist who was trying to prove the Bible was a work of man as you say. The Bible is the only text that Panin could find these patterns in. He found 43000 pages of patterns in the Bible and these were all checked for accuracy by a team of mathematicians. And Panins whole work went right over your head. I am afraid i am not impressed with nothing but your ability to be sarcastic. Yes everything in nature has mathematical patterns, EVERYTHING. But NOTHING that man has done HAVE THESE PATTERNS IN THEM IN THE RANDOM WAY THAT THE BIBLE DOES. Yet the Bible has these patterns. But the patterns could not have been planed by the men who wrote the Bible. Panin set out trying to duplicate them in a sentence and found it took forever and a day to do one sentence but then it did not say what he wanted it to say but it had a pattern. Panin concluded that the universe and the Bible were created by the same mathematician. And Panin knew that no man could create the universe so there had to be a God who created both. Panin knew math and was an atheist but the math proved to him that the Bible was written by God and Not man. Also Moses had the same patterns that Paul had 1400 years later. 40 different authors from uneducated fishermen to kings and farmers and all were more brilliant mathematicians than any who have ever lived by a factor of a googleplex. I have to apoligize for saying this went over your head. I scored the highest score in the math placement test at the local university then anyone has ever scored and math is easy for me. A person has nothing to do with the areas that they are gifted in and there is no shame at all with not being able to understand math of this order. However i have been able to explain it to quite a few high school students. Lou
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Ivan likes math
| Posted On: 01/08/08 09:22:15 PM |
Age 37, NY |
Are you still going on about Ivan Panin? I've explained this to you before--more than three times now. Just because a formula yields mathematical patterns doesn't make something true. All it proves is that there are patterns. Patterns are everywhere. Again, you could insert any text into Panin's formula and it will reveal a pattern. Google it yourself and stop embarrassing yourself with such nonsense. Or do you just not care about these facts as long as occasionally some people fall for it--you can fool some of the people some of the time...The bible is unverifiable not because of a lack of my efforts. It has nothing to do with me. When Moses goes up the mountain to receive the 10 commandments, how is this verified? Moses makes the claim but we only have his word for it. It's nothing but hearsay. Even if god did speak to him up there, how do we know that Moses didn't change things around to meet his own wishes? In other words, even by the bibles own rules (that all men a fallible) we can't trust the words to be wholly true--because they are written by men (sinners). I know that you believe and have faith that the Bible is true, but you are confusing belief with truth and faith with fact. Think about it.
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HOLY BIBLE - WHOLLY TRUE
| Posted On: 01/08/08 01:20:05 PM |
Age 64, OH |
I am sorry dear friend but you have made the very same argument again and that one is not valid. Just because you have not been able or not tried to verify the Bible as true does not mean that no one is able to verify the Bible as true. That argument is arrogant and not valid. Many have had the Bible proven to them as being true. Google Ivan Panin and read how he proved the Bible was true with math. As to Flew, I never claimed this to be an appeal of logic but it is only a testimony. And you did say that the book that said that "Jesus Christ is the Son of God" was not valid. Anyone who holds such an opinion does not know God and so I gave my reply to this. Lou
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no
| Posted On: 01/08/08 12:46:29 AM |
Age 37, NY |
Actually all I'm saying is that religious texts such as the bible are unverifiable truth claims. I've said nothing about gods existence one one way or the other. You should read carefully what I say before jumping to such conclusions. Antony Flew? Is that an appeal to authority? Well, he may say he is wrong about something. But that doesn't make his or anyones new hypothesis correct simply because they believe the previous one false. Where is the logic in that? I don't question his sincerity however.
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A MAN CAN NOT KNOW ABOUT SOMETHING HE DOES NOT KNOW
| Posted On: 01/05/08 08:34:57 AM |
Age 64, OH |
You admit that you do not know God and so say he does not exist. I say that you are being arrogant and foolish. For a man to say there is no God just because he does not know Him is ARROGANT. You can not know my experiences or knowledge. Just because you do not know God does not mean that I can not know God. What would you call any man who made claims about a man that he never met or did not know. You make claims about the Bible; have you ever read it. Even if you have read the whole Bible; would you want to be taught by a man that had read one math book. How do you think this man would teach calculus. He would be a fool don't you think to even attempt such a thing. Buy your own testimony you do not know God; but you think you are an expert on God. A man can not be an expert on something he knows nothing of. Maybe with the wisdom of a few more years you will become wise. Antony Flew said he was wrong about saying there was no God because Flew feels the evidence that science has provided is overwhelming in proving that there is a God. Flew used to hold your opinion but now is aware that he was wrong. He was also humble and courageous enough to even write a book to tell the world of his mistake. Lou
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what
| Posted On: 01/05/08 12:19:35 AM |
Age 37, NY |
I'm not calling you a fool but you foolishly misquoted my statements about the article. I never said there was no such thing as truth. I was merely stating that religions, in general, are statements that claim truth but are not actual truth. One book may claim that truth is that we humans were planted here by aliens in order to become their slaves in the future. Another book may claim that Jesus is the son of God sent here by him to save mankind. And still another book may claim that cigarette smoking is bad for your health. All these statements make truth claims. Only one is valid. Can you guess which one it is.
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THE PERCEPTION OF MAN DOES NOT CHANGE REALITY
| Posted On: 01/04/08 01:14:25 PM |
Age 64, OH |
Your reasoning is not valid at all friend. If there is such a thing as TRUTH, and reality testifies to that every second of every day, then there is one TRUTH and anything that falls short of it is not true. To say that no one knows the TRUTH just because you do not know the TRUTH is vain and arrogant don't you agree. That is a foolish statement and no one should follow a fool. I am not calling you a fool but just say you made a foolish statement if you are saying no one can know the TRUTH or there is no such thing as TRUTH. If there is in fact a CREATOR and if the Bible is true then he promises to reveal Himself to those who will humble themselves and ask Him who he is instead of insisting that reality is what they say it is. I did as he asked and he did reveal Himself to me. Nothing that you can say can change that reality. If you call me a car I will NOT sleep in the garage tonight. You can not speak and even keep yourself from becoming bald. You can not even keep yourself from dying. Lou
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Re: What?
| Posted On: 01/04/08 10:53:50 AM |
Age 32, MI |
Dr. Francis A. Schaeffer said that believing in Relativism was like having your feet firmly planted in mid-air.
Ravi Zacharias has pointed out that because of the Law of Non-Contradiction it is possible that all known religions could be false, but it is not possible that they could all be true (because they have opposing and contradictory truth claims).
Ultimately for anything to be "true" or "false" there must be an objective standard that corresponds to reality. Discerning that objective standard is what is up for debate in the worldview smörgåsbord.
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What?
| Posted On: 01/03/08 02:43:29 PM |
Age 37, NY |
Your Relativistic Assertion says "All religions are essentially the same. They are all equally valid truth claims." But what does that mean? I take this to mean that they all make truth claims. But how is one more valid than the other or how can they be equally valid. In fact they can't be considered valid at all. What they are is essentially claims of truth and nothing more. There is nothing to give the statements any validity--only the statements themselves. This is why they are called "truth claims" not "truth. Like Russell's celestial teapot-orbiting just outside our galaxy.
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WHY FOLLOW A MAN WHO ADMITS HE DOES NOT KNOW THE TRUTH
| Posted On: 01/03/08 11:32:34 AM |
Age 64, OH |
Most of these men are being truthful in part of their statements; they do not know the truth. But they are terribly ARROGANT to say if they do not know the truth then no one else can know the truth. How can some be so foolish to follow a man who admits that he does NOT know the truth. Jesus was humble but yet claimed to not only know the truth but said He was the TRUTH. Jesus was so humble that even though he was God he made Himself nothing and died a criminals death. But he not only claimed to know the way, but said he was The WAY. Jesus is humble but yet said, "no one comes to The father except through Me". This is the man who I have chose, by grace, to follow. Lou
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Is Christianity Arrogant
| Posted On: 01/03/08 09:01:12 AM |
Age 61, MO |
Christianity is about individuals who are surrendered to Christ. It is about humility. There is no room for arrogance. "Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves." (Philippians 2:3). We could often confuse confindence with arrogance. We have confidence when we know absolutely that something is right, or when we know how to do something very well. If we flaunt our knowledge or our talents, then we become arrogant. Just because we refuse to compromise what is right, does not mean that we are arrogant. George Cancilla
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