Tje False Prophet:
| Posted On: 09/21/08 07:13:36 AM |
Age 43, TX |
Purpose Driven AgendaPosted On: 12/28/07 05:51:22 PM Age 57, WI
The "Purpose Driven Agenda" (as well as other faddish trends) is a foretaste of the "abomination of desolation" "standing where it ought not" in the church.
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I see Rick Warren more like Revelation's False Prophet.
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Delicious
| Posted On: 01/03/08 08:42:38 AM |
Age 34, FL |
The hypocrisy that flows from this feedback thread is just amazing. People who are angered that a pastor called an opponent Sanballat return the favor by supposing whether or not another, different pastor is an Anti-Christ, a demonaic or an instrument of the devil to disrupt the church. Absolutely amazing. And to top it off, you warm your cold hearts by believing that this is how God would have you respond, and then you wonder why the world wants nothing to do with you and take your solace in "the way is narrow and few will find it". Bah! Physicians heal thyselves!
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Thank you Eric
| Posted On: 12/30/07 11:01:44 PM |
Age 54, ID |
thank you for your last articles. I was reminded of an article that I read with further information for research.
http://herescope.blogspot.com/2006/03/change-coping-with-disconnectedness.html
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Ye reap what you sow
| Posted On: 12/30/07 08:25:26 AM |
Age 47, MO |
In the end you have Christ and Self and whomever is sitting on the throne of our lives wins. If we sow to the Spirit; life, if we sow to the flesh; death. It's that simple. However, I haven't written off RW or Hybels yet, because I believe their mind is for Christ not for personal gain. But I do believe their methods are of their own devising and not Spirit led. Given that, I still believe a watered down Christianity is being taught that leads others to an aquatic Christ and a leaky boat. In the end, some may be saved others may not, but our job is not to judge their destiny but to teach, reprove, pray, be humble and faithful. So no, RW is not an anti-Christ but a prodigal son and his destiny is not yet known. John
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An anti-Christ?
| Posted On: 12/29/07 12:02:11 PM |
Age 67, IL |
I had the exact same thought as I read the article. It may be a foreshadowing of what will happen, or could be the beginning of what will happen later on. Perhaps both.
If they don't preach Christ as the ONLY way to salvation, then they are anti-Christ. We are either for Him,-OR- against Him. No middle road. We need to be praying!
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Well said
| Posted On: 12/29/07 10:31:34 AM |
Age 53, ID |
Southerland is a common Johnny Come Lately trying to make his own mark in the PDC world. Originally, Church Transitions used the same yellow with blue web page format as the Purpose Driven web site. It just reeks of tag-along profiteering.
As one who was told to leave because I asked too many questions, the Church Transitions is just a hired gun. Why tarnish the Purpose Driven name when you can bring in Church Transitions methodology and over-shadow the exact same but slightly less offensive methods Warren suggests in The Purpose Driven Church. Once the transition is completed, it puts the heat on Church Transitions, not Rick Warren's Purpose Driven fallacy.
As for my household, we will follow the Lord.
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Response to "A blown opportunity"
| Posted On: 12/29/07 10:28:35 AM |
Age 36, IL |
With all due respect to "A blown opportunity", Matthew 28 is talking about what the church should do OUTSIDE it's building. The text says to "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations..." [New American Standard Bible : 1995 update. 1995 (Mt 28:19). LaHabra, CA: The Lockman Foundation.], not to invite people into the church building to get saved. The Purpose Driven phillosophy is to invite, not to go and evangelize. This is in direct disobedience to Jesus Himself.
Acts 2 gives us a glimps of what whe should be doing INSIDE the church building when we meet together as BELIEVERS.
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You have a point up to a point
| Posted On: 12/29/07 06:27:49 AM |
Age 53, VA |
Several years ago the SBC church I attended began to embrace PDC/PDL. It also became part of the Willow Creek Association. At first I was all for it. The church was wrought with a country club mentality and a lot of legalism. It was a dead church. I thought this was how our church would grow and become the biggest church in the county. The first issue that created a lot of controversy was the tradional versus contempory worship service. (Have you noticed that of all the problems that beset the early church, music was NOT one of them, yet today it is THE biggest issue) I thought the church needed new vitality and PDC/PDL seemed to be the ticket. I also believed that the old/legalistitc trouble makers needed to be rooted out. As time went on though I realized that Rick Warren was being preached and not Jesus Christ. Sermons were all centered on Rick Warren's programs. It became very obvious that the direction of the church was now to be "hip and cool" so that the "unchurched" would find us attractive. I finally realized that PDL/PDC was cleverly disquised as "another" gospel and needed to be rejected and started to actively oppose the PDL/PDC move. (As an aside I realized that 2 Cor. 11:14-15 had to apply to somebody and that Rick Warren,et al, could be a candidate) What our church needed was strong discipleship and training in Biblical doctrine not another program. Numerical growth became a driver and a deciever. Well, I generated some friction and in the end we moved on to another church since PDL/PDC was going to become a fixture. The church is still divided and spiritually confused. Definetly not a PDL/PDC success story.
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Amen.
| Posted On: 12/28/07 08:30:32 PM |
Age 52, AR |
Folks seem to be kind of blinded by the PD stuff. You can't help but wonder if it is because of not ever learning how to study and interpret scripture or if they just want to jump on the bandwagon and be somebody, or if they are just easily led astray by some personality, or apostasy. I don't know, but it seems hard to convince any who are panting after it that it is not biblical. Don't give up though, I was sort of taken in with it for a time, but after learning more about studying the Bible and some very helpful teachers out there, I realized what was happening. And also learning to test everything coming from the preacher by scripture, as you encourage!
Thanks for your articles, and speaking out on this subject.
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Rick Warren
| Posted On: 12/28/07 05:54:53 PM |
Age 66, WA |
Do you suppose Rick Warren Could be an Anti-Christ?
He Sounds Like One
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Purpose Driven Agenda
| Posted On: 12/28/07 05:51:22 PM |
Age 57, WI |
The "Purpose Driven Agenda" (as well as other faddish trends) is a foretaste of the "abomination of desolation" "standing where it ought not" in the church.
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Is attack the best form of defence?
| Posted On: 12/28/07 12:45:20 PM |
Age 62, NEW ZEALAND |
It could be that Sutherland is using the term "leader from hell" in the same context as the TV program talks of Neighbours from Hell. It is a very unfortunate choice of words for a Christian leader but I am not sure it deserves the kind of harsh judgemental treatment in this article.
The ongoing often barbarous attacks on Warren, Hybels and related seem to me to be lacking a little grace and perspective. I am always keen to hear well informed, Biblically based and thoroughly argued points of view and this website presents much of it but I find the anti -purpose driven arguments weak, not well researched and relying on emotive claims.
Christ loved the church and gave Himself for the church. Protect it yes, vigorously too if needed but always well seasoned by grace, love and respect. I am aware of the huge value that is derived from much of the work you are attacking and I would want to be a little more convinced that this is the huge problem you claim it is in comparison to other detriment I see in the church.
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Kensington Churches
| Posted On: 12/28/07 09:06:43 AM |
Age 70, MI |
In the greater Detroit area suburbs, we have a growing group of churches collectively called "Kensington" They appear to be a collection of "emerging " churches with a large following of the "feel good" message.
Have you any in depth information about this movement? Members of my family are involved and seem to be content with this feel good agenda.
Thank you
Dennis Knight (dpatrickknight@hotmail.com)
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On the money
| Posted On: 12/28/07 08:20:32 AM |
Age 52, SC |
I've been critical of the Purpose Driven movement from the beginning, even when that was an unpopular position to be in. I'm glad our old-fashioned church never bought into it.
I had that "tingly sensation" and warning flags when the movement was just catching on. That was the warning of the Holy Spirit. Now, the warnings have become much more tangible and your article shows a few of those very real errors. There are plenty more, but you already know that.
Thanks,
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A blown opportunity
| Posted On: 12/28/07 08:14:16 AM |
Age 61, IL |
You spend a great deal of time extrapolating things said by Southerland and Warren and claiming they are saying things that on the face of it, they are not saying. If you were handling the text, the charge would be eisegesis instead of exegesis. If you feel God has called you to sound the trumpet of warning, at the least demonstrate a measure of grace. It might help if you acknowleged the facts as well. The fact is: some people are critical and some are ornery. They can stand there Bible in hand and still be critical and ornery.
Regarding the "Sanballat" issue: There are also those in the church who are not saved and oppose change because they have worked hard to get their religeous country club just where they like it.
Finally, although it sounds wonderful that God out return his favor and anointing to His church/people, I rather doubt that attacking the church growth movement is going to accomplish that. Perhaps if we turn that piercing gaze inward, repent of our failure to reach out to the lost and in fact, our distaste for associating with them as an abandonement of the mission Christ gave us...then this would happen. By the way, the mission of the church was given in Matt. 28, not Acts 2.
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Amazing
| Posted On: 12/27/07 10:33:21 PM |
Age 56, NE |
Seems like they are getting more open about how much they despise those who hold to Biblical truth. Amazing!!
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"Trouble-makers"
| Posted On: 12/27/07 02:45:27 PM |
Age 51, NC |
Oh, for sure this article hits home! After 2 yrs of attempts to expose false teaching in our 6,000 member SBC with the sr. pastor brushing off our concerns, (Rob Bell Nooma in youth group, Peter Grieg, etc) we were told to appear before the assoc. pastor (who did not commence with prayer) who asked us if we came to the church to be "troublemakers". Then, he proceeded to state, "Oh we know your mindset from the start" and " Exactly, WHERE did you come from".
It is obvious that tactics from transitioning were employed in attempts to run us out. There was no SCRIPTURAL" basis for any of this as no one had "sinned again a brother" nor anyone.
The fruits of the spirit were absent from this hierarchy in this church, and disdain and condemnation proceeded out of mouths, along with gossip from even a deacon.
Yes, that is what is going on in PDL churches from what we see. We pray the Lord opens the eyes of those under this apostate teaching and that the message of repentance to the Savior who died in our place becomes the ONLY priority.
Certainly this is NOT from the Jesus, our Lord and Savior we know and love. This "Transitioning" along with these postmodern movements are from the pit of Hell.
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