Where are the specifics?
| Posted On: 01/29/08 02:03:40 AM |
Age 61, CA |
As I read through this, I have to ask where's the beef? so to speak.
There are a lot of innuendos and implications and an apocryphal story about somebody being disowned because they objected to the purpose driven methodology. Apparently, the big objection is that Pastor Warren has signed on to the global warming crowd and, if he were to preach on that as doctrine, I'd object too, but as far as I know, he hasn't, nor has he endorsed homosexuality as others have implied.
It's impossible to disagree with someone, who doesn't give specific facts, and that is what is lacking from those who so far have criticized Pastor Warren. If you can show us where he's expounding false doctrine, then you owe it to all of us to do so, and so far you've failed to do that.
So, specifically, what has he said or wrote that either contradicts scripture or promotes a false gospel?
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glad that you are entrenched in your belief
| Posted On: 01/08/08 07:48:54 PM |
Age 56, OR |
What about new babes in Christ. Where dose Paul talk about those who bring in a false doctrine like you just did??
NOWHERE, because really loved the people and said what needed to be said no matter how intolerant mere man thought Paul was.
I was brought up in a cult, and if I had fallen into a Warren Web I would still be a lost mormon!!!
I have a very different outlook than you. If Warrens gospel is different from the BIBLE, then Warren is wrong, and preaching doctines of demons.
I know, I have been taught those doctrines, by tolerant loving people who wanted high mormon church numbers. And it is for GREED.
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We MUST Contend for the TRUTH
| Posted On: 12/15/07 10:52:29 PM |
Age 44, TN |
Rick Warren is very influential. Vast numbers of pastors are directly influenced by him. Many preach exactly what they download from his website. He has taught many young ambitious pastors to marginalize elderly people who may object to his growth methods. He also doesn't encourage teaching doctrine. People, especially pastors, need to read articles like this one. I pray that God will continue to graciously expose his worldly, humanistic religion.
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It's not reporting
| Posted On: 12/13/07 08:09:52 PM |
Age 35, AK |
It's not reporting. It's commentary, and as such, has a different vetting process than reporting. Furthermore, even if it IS reporting, it's viable as such. The identity of whistleblowers can and should be protected as free speech.
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Strong's
| Posted On: 12/12/07 08:30:37 AM |
Age 33, FL |
George,
My Strong's seems to imply that it could be many different things:
ra‛ râ‛âh
rah, raw-aw'
From H7489; bad or (as noun) evil (naturally or morally). This includes the second (feminine) form; as adjective or noun: - adversity, affliction, bad, calamity, + displease (-ure), distress, evil ([-favouredness], man, thing), + exceedingly, X great, grief (-vous), harm, heavy, hurt (-ful), ill (favoured), + mark, mischief, (-vous), misery, naught (-ty), noisome, + not please, sad (-ly), sore, sorrow, trouble, vex, wicked (-ly, -ness, one), worse (-st) wretchedness, wrong. [Including feminine ra’ah; as adjective or noun.]
I think that extrapolating out just the physical natural disasters could be detrimental to your position. Recognizing of course the the natural flow of the whole verse indicates contrasting positions in the clauses (light, dark & peace, evil) I would think that it would be more indicative that God creates a form of strife, especially in the realm of the political. Having said that, my caution was to the person who just basically said "You're wrong" without even recognizing that the first post was using a Biblical phrase to make his point and then responding with opinion and no source. The world hears enough "Because I say so", we need to be able to respond with more than that.
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How do we really know?
| Posted On: 12/12/07 08:07:15 AM |
Age 53, MN |
I'm disappointed in her "my friend received an email..." and "another friend received an email..." information. I don't trust or respect that kind of reporting. Sorry.
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WE ARE ALL BORN SINNERS
| Posted On: 12/11/07 06:58:06 PM |
Age 64, OH |
I want to comment on the disagreement that some homosexuals say they are born that way and some claim they are not. We are all born sinners and that point is very clear in the scriptures. So they fact that the homosexuals say they are born homosexuals gives them no excuse. When I was less than five years of age I went down to a local store named Nickels and stole a bag of marbles. I wore a jacket to hide the marbles under, it was in between weather. I waited outside until some people went in so I would not be noticed. I took the bag of marbles then left. I felt so bad that I returned them by stealth the same way I had stole them. Now I was sure not taught to steal and I was also not taught to return stolen property. I WAS BORN A THIEF. But that did NOT excuse my stealing. If someone is born in a family that steals does that mean we would just leave them steal our car or money. Of course not. We are all born sinners but none of us have an excuse to sin. this includes homosexuals. The reason homosexuals are so hostile and want everyone to be homosexuals is they are shamed by the anal and oral anal sex that they participate in and they are trying to bury their shame. Lou
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GOOD POINT
| Posted On: 12/11/07 06:41:40 PM |
Age 64, OH |
very good point John - Lou
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Evil in Isaiah 45:7
| Posted On: 12/11/07 03:09:30 PM |
Age 61, MO |
Lest we be confronted with some contradiction, I looked up "evil" in the concordance and the Hebrew translates it as "calamity" or physical destruction such as a tornado, etc. This "evil" is not a moral evil. God is in no way pictured in Scripture as the author of sin. George Cancilla
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Check Your Facts
| Posted On: 12/11/07 07:15:49 AM |
Age 33, FL |
If you believe that the Bible is the inerrant and perfect Word of God, then you must accept that God Himself claims to have created evil. In fact, that phrase in the post you are questioning is a direct quote of Isaiah 45:7, "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." Please be certain of what you are saying before you try to correct someone else, especially when he is actually using the Bible as his platform. Thx!
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Get a grip
| Posted On: 12/10/07 06:38:31 PM |
Age 47, FL |
That's the trouble with this blog medium. People do not read the replies, they just read 2 or 3 lines and go off on emotion. Anyone here who loves Jesus and studies God's Law and the scripture, I could sit and talk with you for hours. Even if we seem to disagree in here. We are born again, we are Christians.
I am sure that Ingrid is incredibly Faithful and I think that Rick Warren is wrong to use his Holy Sanctuary as a rope on the shadowy side of that cliff's edge. But my point was to be careful when publically rebuking a brother.
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Are you kidding me?
| Posted On: 12/10/07 08:12:30 AM |
Age 28, TX |
I assume that you are aware that Jesus claims to BE the Truth. Apparently, truth is important to Him. If we set aside what is right, what is true, and what is godly in order to achieve a narrow set of worldly goals, then not only are we rejecting Jesus' Way, but we are also representing to the unbelievers that it really doesn't matter what they believe...And I must add, do you think Jesus was wrong, and that He could have achieved great reforms by "partnering" with Caesar and the Sanhedrin? All He would have to do was stop calling Himself God, claiming the corner on Truth, and telling people that His Kingdom was not of this world!--Mrs. Pilgrim
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Woe to those who call evil good....
| Posted On: 12/09/07 08:35:47 PM |
Age 55, OH |
Isaiah spoke of those who call evil good and good evil. (Is. 5:20) No where in the bible is homosexuality spoken of in an approving manner. Wherever the bible speaks of homosexuality, it is always in condemnation. God says it is wrong. Period. But it is the one single sin that some people claim to have been born with. Some try to say that they cannot help themselves, that they cannot change. Baloney. God may have "given them over" to their sin, but I don't think it is fair to say God "made" them this way. Why do we Christians expose this darkness? The bible tells us to. Then too, it has been shoved down our throats by the homosexual activists for over 20 years now. We live in a world now where "tolerance" is widely embraced. But the world's road of tolerance is only a one way street. Sadly enough, many within the Body of Christ have bought into this kind of tolerance.
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Woe to those who call evil good....
| Posted On: 12/09/07 08:32:03 PM |
Age 55, OH |
Isaiah spoke of those who call evil good and good evil. (Is. 5:20) No where in the bible is homosexuality spoken of in an approving manner. Wherever the bible speaks of homosexuality, it is always in condemnation. God says it is wrong. Period. But it is the one single sin that some people claim to have been born with. Some try to say that they cannot help themselves, that they cannot change. Baloney. God may have "given them over" to their sin, but I don't think it is fair to say God "made" them this way. Why do we Christians expose this darkness? The bible tells us to. Then too, it has been shoved down our throats by the homosexual activists for over 20 years now. We live in a world now where "tolerance" is widely embraced. But the world's road of tolerance is only a one way street. Sadly enough, many within the Body of Christ have bought into this kind of tolerance.
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Woe to those who call evil good....
| Posted On: 12/09/07 08:26:28 PM |
Age 55, OH |
Isaiah spoke of those who call evil good and good evil. (Is. 5:20) No where in the bible is homosexuality spoken of in an approving manner. Wherever the bible speaks of homosexuality, it is always in condemnation. God says it is wrong. Period. But it is the one single sin that some people claim to have been born with. Some try to say that they cannot help themselves, that they cannot change. Baloney. God may have "given them over" to their sin, but I don't think it is fair to say God "made" them this way. Why do we Christians expose this darkness? The bible tells us to. Then too, it has been shoved down our throats by the homosexual activists for over 20 years now. We live in a world now where "tolerance" is widely embraced. But the world's road of tolerance is only a one way street. Sadly enough, many within the Body of Christ have bought into this kind of tolerance.
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rick warren dissent
| Posted On: 12/09/07 03:00:01 PM |
Age 60, KS |
Wow! Everyone seems to have the answer but I'm not sure to what question. Is there one pastor, priest or elder who knows all the answers? Mr. Warren is one voice among many who are trying to win our hearts for God.
Seems like Christianity is no different than our national political scene. Everyone has an opinion and a label to paste on someone else. Them, thar "lefties" and those neo-cons out there. He/she is leaning right or leaning left.
Here is the deal....we're all sinners!
I know, everyone knows that! Christ wants us to be Lover's. No....not that kind but in a spiritual way! God wants us to Love Him and His Son and He wants us to Love each other while we're at it. In fact, to accept Jesus as our savior, this should be a natural thing for us to do. It ain't an intellectual endeavor to accept Him into our hearts....its a spiritual thing!!! If we do it right....He'll continually be with us in our thinking so we'll naturally show and know the kind of Love He insists on.
I'll assume that Mr. Warren has all good intentions and I'll take the things from what he writes that I think apply to my journey with God. Just like I do things written on this site by the many featured writers. I'm not worried about him or anyone else saying or writing anything that will send me to Hell. I'm way too far entrenched in my relationship with Jesus/God to let that happen. If I offend God, it'll be my own unfettered Sin that does it.
To paraphrase an old Reagan quote: "Love but verify." I think the actual one was "trust, but verify." But for this purpose..Love is the better word.
God Bless!!
p.s. I wonder who Jesus would be hanging around with and preaching to if he were here today?
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Didn't get my point
| Posted On: 12/08/07 08:22:15 PM |
Age 30, MN |
Friend I guess you didn't see my point, I am not a supporter of homosexuality I feel it is not gods ideal. The point I'm making is regardless if it is a "force to be reckoned with" it is not christain like or biblical to pick out one of the many sins written about in the bible and make this the deal breaker sin, as we have by villinizing and alienating one particular sin group. I'll remind you again of gluttony especially in this country. People in this world are dying everyday because of our gluttoness attitude towards things like world hunger. Thats why you don't villinize a specific sin group or as we are trying to do by legeslating sin. We are called to be christ like in ephesians when did Jesus ever try to get the goverment of his day to make certain sin illegal. What I got from this article is that homosexuals are not welcome in our churches, and the christains who believe they aren't welcome I feel very sorry for them and all I can do is pray. I got news, if anyone feels they are not welcome, then either are any of us and there is no argueing that point. I feel there are certain "christains" on tv, the radio, and the internet who are like the pharisees and high priests of jesus's day, but all we can do is follow Jesus's teaching. I have a question???? Knowing what we know of Jesus how would he handle a homosexual???? Think real hard about that before you answer. God Bless.
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Revelation
| Posted On: 12/08/07 08:07:54 PM |
Age 34, KS |
Thank you Brannon for reveling the truth about this article. I'm sure there will be some that claim your not really Brannon Howse, but some people always find some reason not to believe the truth. The Bible says they well be willingly ignorant of the truth. People have been disowned by their families because they won't follow the teachings of Rick Warren. Fact!!! We know a tree by the fruit it bears, Rick fruits are going to be reveled soon enough.
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Rick Warren disent
| Posted On: 12/08/07 04:18:22 PM |
Age 56, MN |
Few words are needed to describe the reaction to Ingrids article.
HERE they are, disernment in these so called Christians, makes me wonder, how the HOLY SPIRT got so stupid.
False converts are filling the churches, lead by wolves, like RICK WARREN.
AS I speak, GOD is already seperating the WHEAT from the TARES, the responses, CLEARLY show that.
WHAT a shame so many will say LORD, LORD< and get the answer,
"AND WHO THE HECK ARE YOU"?
amen, the end is near
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Rick warren Dissent
| Posted On: 12/08/07 02:03:24 PM |
Age 49, TX |
What is truly going on here? Are we together or are we seperated? As those who are Blood bought born again Children of God through the blood of Jesus Christ we have to stop fighting among ourselves when something dangerous is occurring. Whether it is Warren or some other person in the spotlight we have to simply stop fighting with each other over it! Christians have a bad habit of killing their own when it comes to issues. We seem to have our favorite people which we follow, and when those same people are brought up to the "microscope" of examination, then we protect them fully.
There is a dangerous problem in the Church of Jesus Christ today, too many celebrates! We choose to follow men and not Jesus Christ himself. We are like branches in the wind, directed by whether it blows this way or that. We follow our feelings or what we think, instead of what the Scriptures of the Holy Bible say! We spend too much time listening to the many voices in our society instead of what the still small voice of the Holy Spirit says! We are guilty today of living like the society around us and not the Spirit within us! Jesus calls us to live seperated from the world, be in the world and not of it. This doesn't mean that we are to so seperate ourselves that we don't carry out the Great Commission. "Go unto all the world and preach the Gospel." Jesus came not to feed the flock but to seek and save that which was lost. He left an example for all of us to follow, as Believers. All people on the earth can perhaps imitate him but none may be like him. A true Believer in Jesus Christ is "born again." This means a person must receive eternal life through confessing of their sins before God and asking Jesus Christ to come into their lives. They trade their life for His. Paul said, "I am crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live yet not I but Jesus Christ... Jesus stated that "If any man come unto me let him deny himself pick up his cross daily and follow me."
From what I see in the church today is what the great writer Francis Scraffer said, "the western church today is in danger of losing what it truly professes...Jesus Christ.
I don't know much about Rick Warren or much of what he does but what I can truly say is, does his heart and actions follow the same as that of my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ? Is he born again? Does his walk match the Word of God? I don't mean is Mr. Warren perfect what I mean is does he walk as Jesus walked? It is not just our actions but what is in the heart of a man.
Also those whom are truly born again need to study long and hard the Scriptures. A soldier in the army of Jesus Christ needs to know what his commander expects of him
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