Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/28/07 12:03:10 PM |
Age 50, MI |
While I agree with the basis of your article, your statement "There's one megachurch in my city that just built a new gargantuan sanctuary that even includes theater seating with cup holders for the worshiper's coffee! It's not about God; it's about ensuring the worshiper has his caffeine fix during the service!" is just silly and does not fit the rest of your article. What does a comfortable chair and a cupholder have anything to do about hearing the truth of our Savior? I grew up attending church with the straight up wooden pews that were so uncomfortable and couldn't sit still. How does that help me hear what is being taught?
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/20/07 10:41:47 PM |
Age 44, AZ |
My prayer is that GOD, will cause us all to weep and repent and ask for Him to convict us and give us grace to rise up in prayer and act on what we already know. May we hear what the Spirit is speaking.
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Re: Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/13/07 04:20:49 PM |
Age 19, VA |
actually thats a really good point about tyranny, thanks for clarifying.
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Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/12/07 11:18:33 PM |
Age 47, MN |
The term "anarchy" was a direct quote from Pastor Piper. Remember his sermon wasn't directed at this particular topic and that I took the quotes out of the introduction to a sermon on marriage.
Maybe a better way to describe it is like I heard on the radio show, "Generations with Kevin Swanson"... anarchy leads to tyranny. Anarchy (increased threats and acts of terrorism, for example) leads to increased demands for the government to "do something," which results in more laws that are ever-increasing in their oppresiveness (tyranny).
Thanks for reading!
Charley
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Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/12/07 06:43:50 AM |
Age 47, OH |
I couldn't agree more. One must be careful about uncritical submission to human religious authority. That would be the error of the Nicolaitans that Jesus hated, which was a two-class system of human religious authority. "Yet this you do have, that you hate the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate." (Rev 2:6) Also: "But you are not to be called 'Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers. And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. Nor are you to be called 'teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ. The greatest among you will be your servant. For whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted. (Matt 23:8-12). Paul advocates order in the churches and brotherly love, but one must be careful not to fall into the religious authority trap of the Pharisees.
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Re: Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/12/07 06:06:38 AM |
Age 53, IN |
It appears several did not understand my point.
The point is that in this culture some "authority", either a judge, a justice of the peace, a ship's captain, perhaps an apostate "minister", a "woman pastor", or various other types pronounce a couple to be husband and wife. They do it "by the power vested in me by the STATE...". The same STATE that commits myriad evils. How is being proclaimed "married" by an unbeliever any more legitimate than not going through the mumbo-jumbo but instead being committed to your mate? I am not advocating multiple common-law marriages. I am saying the first time two people have "coupled" they are one in God's sight. They are "married". Having multiple partners, whether "married" or not, is wrong. And why do I never hear any preachers warning their congregations about fornication? If fornication is a sin where are the preachers who are warning against it? The fact is there is so much divorce, pre-marital coupling and adultery that nobody pays any attention to it. If people were warned that their first coupling made them the spouse of their "mate" they might think twice. How did Eve become Adam's wife? How did Sarah become Abraham's wife? How did Rebekah become Isaac's wife? How did Mary become Joseph's wife?
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Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/11/07 09:01:11 PM |
Age 50, VA |
"It seems to me that when a man and a woman have "coupled", that is become one, they are married in God's eyes."
If that's true, there's no such thing as fornication or adultery. Merely short, multiple marriages.
In every society, there are recognized norms of marriage. Every society defines what is marriage and what is not. Currently, our society recognizes a legal procedure under the authority of the civil government. Far from being unBiblical, and therefore something Christians can ignore, God calls us to also recognize those norms. We are told to "be subject to the powers that be" (Rom 13). Interesting that it doesn't say anything about the powers that OUGHT to be - that is, we are to be subject even if the government is illegitimate! See also Tit 3:1 and 1Pe 2:13 and following. Christians who live together without a marriage license are fornicating. They are not married.
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/11/07 08:53:37 PM |
Age 50, VA |
" Witness how people of faith cannot speak out against the sin of sodomy in most of Europe or in Canada without incurring the wrath of the state against them. How long will it be before those types of laws (and many that will be worse) come to our land? "
How long? They are already here, in principle.
It's called, "Hate Crime" legislation. Coming in a more restrictive (to Christians) and more virulent form, soon, to a legislature near you!
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/11/07 07:32:27 PM |
Age 19, VA |
You speak of a fear of anarchy, then you say the cause of that anarchy is over-oppressive laws. This seems backwards. Laws are usually associated with, well, a definite lack of anarchy.
Similarly, you ask for a critical eye towards television and movies, but stress the importance of accepting those in biblical authority. If critical thinking is to be used in one area of our lives, surely it is important everywhere. But being critical of things involves a large amount of autonomy, which is of course one of the dangerous things to avoid. This just goes in logical circles of using critical thinking to protect oneself from everything but the thing that demands the thinking to protect itself, and the problem of using our own skills being wrong in the first place. all in all consistency is lacking
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/10/07 04:02:01 PM |
Age 47, OH |
Jesus relied entirely on the Word of God to combat the enemy of our souls and so should we since we are not greater than our master. The greatest thing we can do for our kids is to get the Word of God in their heads, with that, they will know Truth and be able to identify falsehood.
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/10/07 07:52:22 AM |
Age 28, TX |
Very good article. I think I might print this one out for future reference, if that's okay.
There's one point on which I'd take a slightly different tack: the autonomy/independence issue. For myself, I don't define myself as a member of a "family" or as an individual currently in one; I define myself by my relationship with Christ. That I now am a wife and mother is a direct offshoot thereof; and my relationships with my parents, etc., have been altered by that primary definition.
I don't mean to nitpick, but I would lay on the table the notion of defining oneself as God does--because He knows us even better than we do!
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/10/07 04:59:48 AM |
Age 44, KZ |
Awesome stuff, so true
As in America so too in South Africa.
Humans are only interested in self worship.
ME ME ME.....miles away from Christ
Infact Christ is a joke to many
SAD
Come soon Lord Jesus, the cup of sin is full
Gavin Stone, South Africa
your backup at www.ecr.co.za (speakeasy/politics) would be appreciated
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Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 10:26:07 PM |
Age 41, TX |
We have to be careful as to how we approach discussing the subject of marriage with others. Your position seems to say "living together" out of (granted, a state-licensed relationship recognized by state law) wedlock is acceptable to God. This is a hard position to take as essentially a pagan practice, as pagans also practiced sacrifices. The Old Testament Israelites practiced sacrificing under commandments of the Lord, and indeed, Christ was the Ultimate Sacrifice to take our place so that we would be righteous before God on Judgment Day. Jesus didn't include "officially" being married when He said in Matthew 5:28, "But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." Clearly, lust is adultery in God's eyes, married or not, where fornication IS intercourse with someone who is not your spouse. It is, however, okay to lust after your spouse without restriction! =)
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Re: Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 09:29:13 PM |
Age 52, IA |
True enough, that Adam & Eve didn't have to go through a marriage ceremony, but if living together constitutes marriage, what about John 4 and the woman at the well. Jesus said she had had 5 husbands and the one she was now with was NOT her husband. In any case, we agree that there is rampant fornication and adultery today, and believers must set the high standard of one man - one woman for life.
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 02:52:16 PM |
Age 77, CA |
Thank you for making me aware of this article and of the christianworldviewnetwork. I agree with the article, only think we may be closer to the realization of the end product than the auther even thinks. We are so far gone as a nation, it is difficult to believe it is not too late to turn around and recapture life, liberty and freedom to worship God.
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 12:06:47 PM |
Age 39, FL |
Great article, How true. I decided to do what you wrote about in restricting TV/Media coming into our Household and Now I dont even miss it anymore. Thankyou for your article. I just wish other Christians would adhere and take in your message. May God continue to Bless you.
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Cross-Bearing...
| Posted On: 03/09/07 10:54:33 AM |
Age 47, CO |
Excellent article. Simply put, this article expands on the simple but transforming truth that "...If anyone would come after [Jesus], let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow [Him]. (Luke 9:23)
Will we be the "rich young ruler" who loved this world or Peter who said... "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life..." (John 6:68)???
The culture has become such that if we are to follow Christ, we will NOT fit in!
Let us fight the good fight and run the race... Being careful to NOT love this world on their terms, but on His...
"Woe to you, when all people speak well of you, for so their fathers did to the false prophets. (Luke 6:26)
"Blessed are you when people hate you and when they exclude you and revile you and spurn your name as evil, on account of the Son of Man! Rejoice in that day, and leap for joy, for behold, your reward is great in heaven; for so their fathers did to the prophets. (Luke 6:22-23)
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 10:08:28 AM |
Age 53, IN |
A very fine article. I agree with nearly every point made. The only thing I would question is when the writer got to the part about a couple being at the altar. I realize "going to the altar" has been the practice for hundreds of years but it really is a pagan thing. We really don't require a minister or an altar to be married in God's eyes. When two people have committed themselves to each other in the sight of God and become one they are married. There are no directions in the scriptures that are set out to be followed to marry two people. All those things are man-made. It seems to me that when a man and a woman have "coupled", that is become one, they are married in God's eyes. Which means that young people who have casual sex with a variety of partners, though they may eventually "marry" one of them, have already committed adultery over and over. Or at least fornication. One can be an adulterer before choosing an official mate and going to the altar.
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 08:45:54 AM |
Age 43, AL |
Excellent article! It spoke directly to me. Thank you for writing this.
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Re: Debauchery, Barbarism, and Anarchy: Preparing for Our Cultures Future
| Posted On: 03/09/07 08:06:11 AM |
Age 37, TX |
Good article, and a frightening reminder about the future for our children.
This quote from the article is important: "As couples, we must work to have a regular, happy, vigorous sex life....for that is how God intended it." Scripture is clear on this subject, and you hit the nail on the head. Unfortunately, as a man, I have seen that too many Christian women conveniently downplay the crucial significance of this.
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